I think the old west FEEL is what they are going for. In other words, Joss in not trying to retell American history within the confines of this show, instead he is using these events as a thematic springboard for this show. So the reavers are *like* really bloodthirsty tribes (I think certain other parts of some plains tribes would be applicable) in that they inspire huge fear, they enjoy doing that and that they travel around deliberately causing damage, but they aren't telling the story of any specific tribe.
Sometimes a thing gets broke, can't be fixed.
Kaylee ,'Out Of Gas'
Firefly Spoilers
Discussion of all Firefly episodes, including "Trash", "The Message", "Heart of Gold", and any movie news.
scrappy - Sep 30, 2002 12:38:34 am PDT #16 of 1424
Nobody
Michele T. - Sep 30, 2002 6:44:34 am PDT #17 of 1424
with a gleam in my eye, and an almost airtight alibi
Matt, it's what I'm hoping for myself, to be honest.
Melusina - Sep 30, 2002 7:57:15 am PDT #18 of 1424
Nice is different than good.
What Scrappy said. Whedon is doing exactly what he did with BTVS - playing with the conventions of a genre. The Reavers may occupy the same space in the Firefly world as "bloodthirsty savages" do in the traditional Western, just as the Independents function as "Confederate soldiers who are starting over on the Frontier". None of that indicates anything about Whedon's attitude toward Native Americans or the Civil War. Whedon is simply using the framework and stock characters of the Western genre to tell his story.
candyb - Sep 30, 2002 8:03:15 am PDT #19 of 1424
They may be like orcs from LotR or the Magogs from Andromeda.
But I don't think Joss will have a big glowy dark lord be an organized evil directing their activities.
River seems to have an extreme mystical sensitivity to them, which maybe hints at something more? Or just a plot device?
Suzanne B. - Sep 30, 2002 8:14:20 am PDT #20 of 1424
aka FOG
I think Joss is merging the western theme of "blood thirsty savages" with the freaks from Road Warrior/Mad Max or the Morloks from the Time Machine.
The Reavers have strayed from civilization and lost their humanity. The 13th Warrior was on TV last nite and that film deals with the same themes. A culture that does not view its self as human and preys upon human civilization.
I don't think that exact parallels, old west settlers vs. native, can be drawn.
Nutty - Sep 30, 2002 8:30:22 am PDT #21 of 1424
"Mister Spock is on his fanny, sir. Reports heavy damage."
Especially considering how, in space and on newly-terraformed planets, there is no such things as 'natives'. At best, there's the conflict between we-were-here-first, leave-me-alone wildcatters and the legally-endowed, dominant-paradigm-perpetuating settlers. And cowboys-and-schoolteachers is a worthwhile conflict to study, but it doesn't carry the same connotations of racial/cultural conflict as cowboys-and-Indians.
Sophia Brooks - Sep 30, 2002 8:31:42 am PDT #22 of 1424
Cats to become a rabbit should gather immediately now here
OK-- so who has read the pilot and wants to talk?
Megan E. - Sep 30, 2002 8:33:48 am PDT #23 of 1424
Is there a link to the pilot online?
P.M. Marc - Sep 30, 2002 8:35:28 am PDT #24 of 1424
So come, my friends, be not afraid/We are so lightly here/It is in love that we are made; In love we disappear
Me! Me!
Inara is so much less annoying in the pilot, and the tensions are higher, and...
Damn it.
Fox was on c-r-a-c-k
§ ita § - Sep 30, 2002 8:35:49 am PDT #25 of 1424
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.
I'm with those that see a distinction between the Western genre (which has bloodthirsty attackers) and a depiction of the American West. Space Western only need draw from the former.
OTOH, I could see a Reaver story where we get the full "why" of it all. Which need not be as simple as what we've seen so far.
Megan -- it's where Shrift keeps her stuff.