Supernatural 2: Why is it our job to save everybody?
[NAFDA]. This is where we talk about the CW series Supernatural! Anything that's aired in the US on TV (including promos) is fair game. No spoilers though — if you post one by accident, an admin will delete it.
I think Dean was relatively happy in S1, with the caveat that a lot of that came from having Sam with him again.
But he never had any overlap with having both his father and Sam and not the looming shadow of YED. That's why I don't give him any happy points.
And I do think that the speech he gave Ben had distinct tinges of self-loathing in it. But I guess I don't see how to devalue yourself as much as he does in any context outside of hunting without having hatred there.
He's a thrill junkie to some extent, so there's always going to be that adrenaline rush for him, I think.
I think Dean hates himself and any hate it appears he has for hunting is more his low self esteem issues than actual hate of the trade. I'm sure he doesn't hate what his brother and father did, although he probably hates that he had to do it. I like to think he can at least take pride in a job well done, and lives saved.
I was remembering Dean's expression in Croatoan when he told Sam he was tired. And that was before the weight of the world came crashing down on top of him, pretty much literally. Sam's death, Hell, the angel's expectations, Sam's addiction, the demonic forces chasing them, learning about their half-brother, knowing that as fast as he ran to catch up it was almost certainly a contest where either the world would lose or he'd lose his brother. No wonder he's exhausted. I hope for his sake the year with Lisa helped him recuperate a bit, but the half year or so with RoboSam would have worn him down yet again.
I think he gains satisfaction in putting down evil things and in helping people. I don't see any of the glimpses of joy we used to get at the beginning. Either it's all been beaten out of him, or he has undergone an attitude shift towards hunting.
edit -- sorry - just realized I didn't reference the quotes at the top. They're there because I agree with the sentiments and see Dean as an amalgam of them.
I don't see any of the glimpses of joy we used to get at the beginning
I'm still clinging to the stupid goofy smiles we got when Sam got his soul back. It wasn't an overarching happy, but good god, it was nice to see some unadulterated joy that wasn't just "boobies!"
I think to hate himself he needs to want to be something better or different. And with Ben, in that speech, maybe it was true -- he hated that he couldn't be (or didn't believe he could be) what Ben needed. And possibly Lisa, too.
But on the whole I think he just doesn't care enough. In my head, he's come to accept that he is who he is, and it's not much. In other words, DEEEEEEEAN.
Sam, on the other hand, I think was probably pretty happy at Stanford. But I think Sam is and always has been better at compartmentalization, and understanding who he is. As far back as After School Special you see it -- when the teacher asks him what he wants to do, and he realizes no one has ever asked him that before. I think no one ever took the time to ask that of Dean, but I'm not sure he would have been able to answer with anything other than what his dad wanted for him.
So Sam, I'm sure, had some unhappiness and regret about losing John and Dean while he was there, but he was also mature enough to embrace the life he was building and find happiness in it. I don't ever worry about Sam's happiness the way I do about Dean's, because I think he's always been drawn as a less damaged person, for all he was the target of a demon plot.
HOW CAN YOU NOT WORRY ABOUT SAM???
Okay, you said the way you worry about Dean. Sorry...I just...it was blinding for a second.
I think the difference is that Sam has been trying to be happy. Had been trying to be happy. Now he's just trying to make up for what he caused (not all his fault!) when he was trying to do things for himself. So he has that beating up of himself to do.
Dean never got as far as trying to do anything for himself, because I don't see him as visualising himself outside of a fucking, eating, saving, and brothering machine. He just needed his pieces in place, and then he could go forward and do his job.
Okay, you said the way you worry about Dean. Sorry...I just...it was blinding for a second.
Sorry, dear.
For me, it's right there in the pilot. Sam took off and took care of himself, really damn well. And yes, he was trying to be happy, and might have been for a long time if circumstances hadn't intervened.
Dean has only ever taken care of other people, and no one has ever taken care of him. SO I WORRY MORE.
I don't ever worry about Sam's happiness the way I do about Dean's, because I think he's always been drawn as a less damaged person, for all he was the target of a demon plot.
I think the fact that Sam was ignorant of monsters until he was 8 or so, and didn't have a stable, secure life ripped away from him the way Dean did would have a lot to do with that.
In regards to why they're still hunting, I would love to see the boys talk about that in-show.
Now I'm reminded of a Drill Sergeant I had in basic, we called her Mama Bear. We all loved her and tried to take care of her, be good and made sure she got home to her husband and kids at a timely hour.
I think the fact that Sam was ignorant of monsters until he was 8 or so, and didn't have a stable, secure life ripped away from him the way Dean did would have a lot to do with that.
I just backspaced a post where I was saying I was surprised that Dean and Sam's roles weren't reversed, since Dean had a taste of normalcy whereas Sam was born into it, and then remembered, yeah, they sheltered Sam for as long as they could until he found something hinky and pushed the issue.
Even before they retconned Brady (where are my threesomes?) into Jess, even before she got killed, that wasn't going to be properly happy. Some people can leave family, and there's not much of a dent to be seen. Sam can get out from under John's shadow, but how much can he extricate himself from Dean, even when they're apart for years? That's going to come up during the quiet times, and it's going to be a hole in an otherwise good relationship with a great woman. More about me makes sense when you meet my sister. And we ain't got shit on the Winchesters. Your loved one wants to make that sort of sense of you.
They were all they had. And then no more. I don't like S/D/J fic. Because I don't think D needs to go there, that's ick. Though I have discussed sharing men with my sister, nobody gets to fall in Sam like love.
This made more sense at the start of the post.