I'm just, uh, just feeling kinda... truthsome right now. And, uh... life's just too damn short for ifs and maybes.

Mal ,'Heart Of Gold'


Boxed Set, Vol. V: Just a Hint of Denial and a Dash of Retcon  

A topic for the discussion of Doctor Who, Arrow, and The Flash. Beware possible invasions of iZombie, Sleepy Hollow, or pretty much any other "genre" (read: sci fi, superhero, or fantasy) show that captures our fancy. Expect adult content and discussion of the Big Gay Sex.

Marvel superheroes are discussed over at the MCU thread.

Whitefont all unaired in the U.S. ep discussion, identifying it as such, and including the show and ep title in blackfont.

Blackfont is allowed after the show has aired on the east coast.

This is NOT a general TV discussion thread.


sj - Mar 02, 2012 9:10:46 am PST #19504 of 30001
"There are few hours in life more agreeable than the hour dedicated to the ceremony known as afternoon tea."

Though captain Reynard can stay.

It would be nice if they used him more, gave a little more of the back story of his character. That was one thing I liked about this episode. I'd also like the show to get over, the no one can know my secret thing. I'm so sick of that trope in Sci-fi/fantasy shows.


Typo Boy - Mar 02, 2012 9:37:53 am PST #19505 of 30001
Calli: My people have a saying. A man who trusts can never be betrayed, only mistaken.Avon: Life expectancy among your people must be extremely short.

In this case it seems to be less "no one is allowed to know my secret" and more "I can't prove my secret cause no one else can see what I can see". Of course, given the level of writing, he could tell her his secret, be unable to prove it, and she could accept it because she has faith in him. (Yes, I know, accepting someone's hallucinations as real is not actually the most loving thing to do - hence the phrase "given the level of writing".)


Toddson - Mar 02, 2012 9:40:46 am PST #19506 of 30001
Friends don't let friends read "Atlas Shrugged"

I kind of watched Awake - it looks promising, but at the time I was being distracted.

I was left wondering - does the guy ever actually get any sleep? That may well be explained at some point and I missed it, but I often find myself wondering about odd little details.


§ ita § - Mar 02, 2012 2:30:40 pm PST #19507 of 30001
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.

Okay, Awake was okay. It had that air of a show that might succeed because the conceit's not explained at all, and has a pretty simple effect. No buttons, no switches, and probably on a couple other variations for sweeps.

No, it doesn't seem like he sleeps. Eyes close, eyes open. Fuck the show's cancellation, he's going to fritz the neurons in a year or so.


Juliebird - Mar 02, 2012 2:42:13 pm PST #19508 of 30001
I am the fly who dreams of the spider

It seems to me that he sleeps, because he goes to bed in one reality and wakes up in the next, in the interim he sleeps.


§ ita § - Mar 02, 2012 3:38:44 pm PST #19509 of 30001
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.

He said he closed his eyes and then he opened his eyes. He didn't say or imply there was anything happening inbetween, so that's what I was going with.


Juliebird - Mar 02, 2012 3:46:08 pm PST #19510 of 30001
I am the fly who dreams of the spider

I'm thinking that he closes his eyes, and if he doesn't dream, the next thing he knows is that he's waking up. And so the abbreviated explanation excluding his sleeping.

Which makes me wonder, what happens if he pulls an all-nighter? What if he gets called to a crime scene at four in the morning and doesn't get home until six, seven in the morning? Will he have already have woken up in the next reality, or will there be a shift at a specific time? Midnight? 6 am?


§ ita § - Mar 02, 2012 3:51:16 pm PST #19511 of 30001
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.

I'm thinking that he closes his eyes, and if he doesn't dream, the next thing he knows is that he's waking up. And so the abbreviated explanation excluding his sleeping.

I do think, narratively, it's on them to explain that. If they have him both say "I close my eyes, I open my eyes" with no implication of anything happening inbetween and also show the same thing (I didn't notice any shots of him sleeping), then it's entirely our decision to insert sleep there. It's not strictly incorrect, because I don't think that they have explicitly said it's not happened, but they have done absolutely no hinting of their own.

It wouldn't be a retcon, basically, if they said next week that he never slept, from the bits I've caught so far.


Juliebird - Mar 02, 2012 4:01:01 pm PST #19512 of 30001
I am the fly who dreams of the spider

I think this is an instance of proving that God doesn't exist by the merit that there is not concrete evidence that he does, and vice versa.

Until we know more, and all that.

My hold that he does in fact sleep is that showing a man sleeping is terribly dull, and that there have been no other signs of time slipping. The assumption being that between the time that he falls asleep, and the time that he wakes up, he slept a full night.

It'd be another thing if he falls asleep in one reality at 10 pm and he wakes up at 10:15 in the other reality. Then I'd start worrying about him fritzing out due to lack of sleep.


Frankenbuddha - Mar 02, 2012 4:04:34 pm PST #19513 of 30001
"We are the Goon Squad and we're coming to town...Beep! Beep!" - David Bowie, "Fashion"

Also, for those who missed it on original airing or the Bravo rebroadcast, the pilot is scheduled on the channel formerly known as Sci-Fi - Monday or Tuesday night - I just put it in the rotation but I'm currently spacing on when or what time, so check your DVRs or listings. Sorry.