Much like Owen using the alien whatsit in the pilot of Torchwood, then. Yeah - I'd call that rape.
I never could really like Owen after that pilot episode. To me he always remained the creepy rapist.
Death is your art. You make it with your hands day after day. That final gasp, that look of peace. And part of you is desperate to know: What's it like? Where does it lead you? And now you see, that's the secret. Not the punch you didn't throw or the kicks you didn't land. She really wanted it. Every Slayer has a death wish. Even you.
Spike ,'Conversations with Dead People'
Boxed Set, Vol. V: Just a Hint of Denial and a Dash of Retcon
A topic for the discussion of Doctor Who, Arrow, and The Flash. Beware possible invasions of iZombie, Sleepy Hollow, or pretty much any other "genre" (read: sci fi, superhero, or fantasy) show that captures our fancy. Expect adult content and discussion of the Big Gay Sex.
Marvel superheroes are discussed over at the MCU thread.
Whitefont all unaired in the U.S. ep discussion, identifying it as such, and including the show and ep title in blackfont.
Blackfont is allowed after the show has aired on the east coast.
This is NOT a general TV discussion thread.
sj - Jul 01, 2011 9:18:24 am PDT #17526 of 30001
"There are few hours in life more agreeable than the hour dedicated to the ceremony known as afternoon tea."
tiggy - Jul 01, 2011 9:26:39 am PDT #17527 of 30001
I do believe in killing the messenger, you know why? Because it sends a message. ~ Damon Salvatore
How is that yes and no?
I just mean that if the show was trying to send a message that rape is wrong then they ultimately failed. both by having Tara go back to Willow and again when Buffy forgives Spike and then tells him she loves him.
No, there's the reporter (?) in this past season. He also compelled her when she blanched and then continued having his merry way with her.
we've since been shown that she knows what's going on and continues to stick around though. that's who i was referring to when i mentioned Andie.
-t - Jul 01, 2011 9:28:42 am PDT #17528 of 30001
I am a woman of various inclinations and only some of the time are they to burn everything down in frustration
we've since been shown that she knows what's going on and continues to stick around though.
We have? Admittedly, I watch VD with half an eye, but I had the impression she only stuck around because she was being compelled.
§ ita § - Jul 01, 2011 9:31:40 am PDT #17529 of 30001
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.
She came back to him afterwards (and he was surprised he didn't have to compel it out of her), but he has definitely used his powers to overcome her reluctance. Her forgiving him doesn't make it consensual.
If she was fully consensual all the time, there would be no compelling happening at all. There's clearly compelling happening.
tiggy - Jul 01, 2011 9:38:08 am PDT #17530 of 30001
I do believe in killing the messenger, you know why? Because it sends a message. ~ Damon Salvatore
i'm mostly referring to this scene. [link]
§ ita § - Jul 01, 2011 9:48:05 am PDT #17531 of 30001
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.
I can't listen to audio from work, so I have no way of telling what went down. When they first got together, in the bathtub, there was compelling happening. He removed her ability to consent.
-t - Jul 01, 2011 9:52:20 am PDT #17532 of 30001
I am a woman of various inclinations and only some of the time are they to burn everything down in frustration
Well, I'm gonna stick with my gut reaction, which is that it doesn't matter how the victims react, really, once he compels a woman to sleep with him he's forced her into sex and that's rape. Whether that means anything in particular about his character or the show or whatever is open to debate but that he's done that seems pretty clear.
§ ita § - Jul 01, 2011 9:55:53 am PDT #17533 of 30001
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.
Forgiving a rapist also doesn't make it not rape. Loving a rapist doesn't make it not rape. Rape is what happens, right then, when a person's ability to consent is removed, and sexual acts are performed. Not what happened before or afterwards.
tiggy - Jul 01, 2011 10:16:28 am PDT #17534 of 30001
I do believe in killing the messenger, you know why? Because it sends a message. ~ Damon Salvatore
agreed and conceded, ita. i don't think the writers thought Damon would be as popular as he became. why, i don't know. Damon from the books is still a sarcastic ass much of the time, but he never compels anyone to have sex with him. give him free things and let him drink from them, absolutely. but there's no rape.
follow up question for this discussion. are rapists in fiction irredeemable?
smonster - Jul 01, 2011 10:36:21 am PDT #17535 of 30001
We won’t stop until everyone is gay.
What ita said.