Steph, I don't know why it bugged me. It just did.

But I like ita's reading, and I think it is the one I shall take from now on.

ETA:

First, a disclaimer - I am very sleepy, so if I make even less sense than usual, that is why.

Second, on further thought - I think the reason it bothered me a little was that somewhere some time I have heard something about "all women" having a rape fantasy, and I hate "all" anything statements. All of them. (All absolutes are false, including this one, hardy har har har.) I think that common thread among the women touched my "all" button (hmmmm. we'll leave that alone). I assume you all know how it is - we all have things that bug us, and we sometimes see them when they're not really there, because we're kind of looking for them.

he didn't get any kind of consent from her, he just made assumptions and acted on them and was wrong

Was he wrong to kiss her? Was that assumption incorrect too? Or did he make two assumptions, one of which was wrong?

Don't get me wrong -- all the way from the kiss I figured it was way out of line. Rebecca was less clear (judging from the lack of her yelling "No! Don't! Gross! SPECIAL AGENT HERE!" like I was).

I just realized I sure used "all" a lot in my complaints about "all."

Did you know that Dude was into S&M?

If it matters that she knew, then that line between BDSM and assault just got incredibly blurry.

But I still don't think that excuses it or, honestly, even mitigates it. If my hypothetical date likes skydiving and I say, "Oh that sounds cool. Tell me more." I doubt that would lead to the assumption that it's okay to toss me out of plane without my consent after creme brulee.

This, exactly.

I'm going to go nap now. Thank you all for a discussion of BDSM that proved quite enlightening and made me question my own judgements and ideas about how the world works. Buffistas are the foamiest.

Have fun, Kiba. And remember: dream of spanking.

If my hypothetical date likes skydiving and I say, "Oh that sounds cool. Tell me more." I doubt that would lead to the assumption that it's okay to toss me out of plane without my consent after creme brulee.

If your date likes, say, kissing and then starts kissing you without asking, or goes for your buttons or under the skirt -- same degree of bad?

Or is your date taking place in the plane, with the cargo door open? Does he shove you out of the plane, or put on your gear and then take it off when you freak?

The sounds you hear are of me stretching an analogy until it snaps.

It's not any squickier than some things I know you've seen. I thought the episode was really fascinating (even if all the parts didn't exactly work for me). It's an interesting subject--proven by the interesting discussion here.

Okay. My mind went straight to Faith torturing Wesley here, was that intentional?

What if instead of cuffing her, he'd smacked her in the face? Would that count as assault?

What if instead of cuffing her, he'd smacked her in the face? Would that count as assault?

yes, as would cuffing her