Well, hard-working ranch owners probably don't have much time for frippery.

My point, aside from the flippancy, was that he seems able to befriend women who are competent at non-gender specific tasks, Kaylee and Zoe. Where he has more romantic feelings toward a woman with a more traditionally feminine occupation.

I think that a single mother who owned a ranch would have less occasion to frip and probably less of the wherewithal to do it with.

Was she poor? Poorer than she'd have been if she was married? It's a whole lot of hypothesis.

I think it's a bit of a stretch. As noted above, I think that Zoe is a soldier, and his soldier, and that's easy enough and gender-independent. So is Kaylee, plus she's just so damned cute. Inara is deliberately distant, and in a profession for which he has contempt.

I don't know if you have to infer how much his mother may have disdained pretty things to explain anything.

Do you think that Mal comes from a Jossiverse version of the King Ranch? Where they have servants and 'hands that did all the work while, he was sent to was sent off to some boarding school that the Tams would appreicate and his mom entertained high society in town somewhere? Because that isn't how I've imagined his childhood.

Not poor -- just not with lots of extras and less money and more land and livestock. That is what I've imagined.

Do you think that Mal comes from a Jossiverse version of the King Ranch?

I don't think his having a father in place or not has anything to do with whatever a King Ranch is -- that's my point. His mother could have had a fetish for porcelain puppies, for all I know. That's what I'm saying.

This may be a semantic distinction that only exists in my head.

Eh, quite possibly, but you've got a point. I think you're right that the basis for Mal and Zoe's relationship is that they're a team, above and beyond anything else. And they do talk--just not, you know, about their feelings and stuff. They have the "stoic guy thing" friendship down.

Zoe and Wash is different. She's in love with him, in a way I doubt she could ever be with Mal.

I don't know if you have to infer how much his mother may have disdained pretty things to explain anything.

I quite agree.

Hmm. It was an idle speculation, nothing more. And I didn't mean to imply that Mama Reynolds disdained pretties, only that she probably didn't have time for them. I never got the impression that Mal came from money. I think I heard him mention or imply that his life before the war was hard. He seemed to empathise with the settlers they dropped off with a few head of stock on some moon as soon as it was terraformed. But I could be entirely mistaken and have just read my own expectations into it.

I guess what I was trying to say was something of what Beverly said and also that for the most part -- unless you are giant big-time ranchers -- ranchlife is hard. Ranchers tend to be cash poor and not have time for frip -- even had they enjoyed same.

I can imagine that as Mal was growing up -- his mom having chosen to be a rancher -- would have put frippery aside, so that even if she liked it -- he may not have known.

The harshness of the life would likely only have been increased by her being single -- but would not necessarily have changed had Mal's dad been around.

I can imagine it too -- I think it's plausible. I don't think it's either definite or required though. As I said, I never imagined he had a luxurious lifestyle. I didn't know what his mother's marital status and job had to do with his taste in women, especially when you have to go through her expression of her aesthetic tastes to get to it.

Which, because I've spent a ton of posts on it sounds like I'm beating up Beverly. I'm just wondering about the lines drawn, and the need for those lines -- Occam's razor can probably get you there quicker, without fanon.

I think Mal's easy friendships with women is more related to the show creators' easy friendships with women.

This does not explain Angel.

the show creators' easy friendships with women.

Wait, I thought they were sexist bastards?

I so can't keep track anymore...