Okay, I know I've done a bad thing here, but I've skipped right to the end to see what's being proposed -- and I don't understand the proposal. I will, of course, go back and read things but if it goes for voting there might be more stupid people like me who can't figure out what's going on.

Sorry, folks, I went to bed last night.

The proposal I made was for the creation of a non-fiction thread. I'm going to wait until the voting has gone through on that to propose the premium/cable setup.

I get what you are saying here, and I know Natter and the board can't ever be all things to all people, but to me, there is a difference between situations in which people don't post in Natter for a little while because of the flow of the discussion at that moment and situations in which people don't post something at all because they feel that having the discussion in Natter is against the rules.

I do hate people felt like they couldn't talk TV in Natter. It was made explicit in the experimental proposal that they could, and whoever it was that was trying to nanny the talk out of Natter should have been nannied, him/herself. That was pretty much a user error, not a fault of the proposal itself. Someone should have noticed and should have spoken up (I'm pointing that finger at me, too).

I always felt excluded from the TV talk in Natter, because I was seldom around when it happened, and when it did happen, it didn't seem to involve shows I watch and/or want to talk about. And when I tried to start my own TV talk in Natter, it usually only garnered a response or two.

I found discussion much more sustainable in the TV threads. My preference is single show threads for the most part, but I do think there are shows (particularly half-hour shows) that would do well in buckets, and I am not afraid of being spoiled in bucket threads for other shows. Bucket threads aren't my favorite, but they're still better than Natter for me.

Hey, do we need to open Lightbulbs now, with four seconds to the original proposal?

I don't know how I feel about the experimentals. They were not a homerun for me. The conversations that I had in those threads were very much like the conversation I have had in Natter about TV - possibly with different participants and about different shows, but the feel was the same. As a spoilerphobe who timeshifts, it was hard for me to remember what threads I could go into when, and skimming past whitefont in Natter is what I'm used to, so it seems simpler.

I never got completely comfortable in the experimental threads. That may be a byproduct of only having them open for a month, I don't know, but the change that they represent doesn't feel accomplished to me - they are still sort of a novelty act and I don't know how keeping them would ultimately shake out. I don't think the ship has sailed on changing the board culture - we are clambering around the masts and testing out the rudders and sails but they ship is still in the harbor and may not have even lifted anchor, as far as I'm concerned.

I, for one, found the new threads much better for the way I watch / discuss TV shows. I rarely went into Natter to discuss shows for a couple of reasons. One was picking out the posts about the show that I was interested in. I'm not a regular Natterite and just finding what I want when I'm hundreds of posts behind is awkward, even with the search function. Another was that, for whatever particular reason, the majority of discussion tends to occur after the west coast has watched the show, which is usually later than I want to stay up. By the time I get around to trying to find the discussion the next day, see point one above. With the bucket threads, even if I wait until the next morning to read I can find them right away. No searching and skipping and sometimes missing interesting posts. Plus, the fact that it's all in one place tends to prolong the discussion. I've seen more posts for House and Grey's Anatomy in the bucket threads than I ever found in Natter. It may have been there, but I gave up in frustration.

So, that's just how it works for me. I'm up for seconding any proposal for bucket threads.

SA said:

The proposal I made was for the creation of a non-fiction thread. I'm going to wait until the voting has gone through on that to propose the premium/cable setup.

SA did get four seconds, once connie chimed in, so Lightbulbs should be opened for her proposal.

I really enjoyed the non-fiction thread. I don't like being spoiled and we usually watch a couple of days later, so I could never participate in whatever discussion there was in Natter. I could wait to read the non-fiction thread until I'd seen the episode and usually discussion was still going on. I am a big Survivor fan and this is the first time I got to really discuss it with my fellow Buffistas.

fwiw, my $.02. it is nigh impossible for me to keep up in Natter. if i do happen to go in there, read what's been said and comment on it i usually end up not having the time to go back and see if anyone has responded to me.

the Experimental threads allowed me to discuss all tv shows with you guys when before it was only the select few shows that already have bucket threads. i like discussing tv with all of you. it was a little frustrating not being able to go in the network drama thread until i'd seen all the dramas i thought might be discussed, but after i had seen them it was extremely easy to read and reply and keep the conversation going days after the episodes had aired. i think perhaps those of you who are arguing that you couldn't discuss the shows because you don't see them right away didn't even try to go in days later and discuss because i seriously had no problem doing so.

if this is convoluted, i apologize. i haven't eaten or had caffeine as of yet today.

I had a real problem with whitefonted TV talk in Natter. It seemed like it would go on forever sometimes, espcially after an episode of Grey's Anatomy or something.

And also? Since I read the board from my phone frequently, and white font doesn't work on my phone browser? Scrolling past whitefonted TV talk quickly become scrolling past everything. Or really just not reading Natter at all.

So keeping TV talk in Natter can have just as profound an effect on some members of the board as not having it in Natter has on others.