Head orc this time round -- with the missing fingers and obscured eyes. Oh, and how does he die in the theatrical?

I really lament the lack of Lurtz. Not that he needed to live past the end of FotR, just that he was a charismatic (or is my sickness showing) baddie, and TTT especially lacked anyone that brutal and bad, yet sexy.

Ah, I thought that might be who you were talking about. I never got his name. In the theatrical, I'm not sure we do see him die. At least, I had the same question you did when [Aragorn?] killed him in the EE. I think we just lose track of him in the TE.

As for charismatic baddies, I have to admit to having a slight crush on one of the Haradrim mumakil-drivers. The actor was in at least one of the docs I watched yesterday (Shane someone?)--very cute. He was listed as "Harad something #2" but he was the only one I remembered or recognized. He's the one who blows the horn when the mumakil come storming onto the field. Pity he gets killed so quickly.

eta: heh, my memory clearly sucks. I blame it on being sick.

cereal:

I'd have to rewatch to figure out the timing of the taking of Osgiliath, the attempt to reclaim it, and the eventual siege of Minas Tirith vs. the timeline of events in Rohan; I wasn't paying very close attention. Regarding Faramir's second-in-command, though, I didn't think there was any difference between what happened to him in the TE and the EE. Did you think he was wounded earlier in the EE?

In the theatrical version, I remember the second in command going down and being killed. In the EE, we see him fall, cut away to the retreat (at least, there may have been more), and then it's in an empty Osgiliath that he gets offed. It may have been empty in the theatrical, I just don't remember seeing it empty. So it felt briefer.

That mumakil driver freaked me out. But I did remember him.

Although the taking of Osgiliath takes much longer, going into late morning, it doesn't make any more sense. You know, when you are being attacked, and your attackers are being sneaky, there isn't much reason for YOU to be sneaky in return. It's OK to yell and use arrows at that point.

(The whole day/night/time shifting made sense to me, in some ways, but in other ways, not. And you know what? At the key moment when the Rohirrim show up? Sun still rising in the northwest.)

Also, Strider's speech before the Black Gate makes even less sense in the EE than in the theatrical. In the theatrical, it represented wishful thinking; in the EE, it turned into something tantamount to a lie.

More about Gandalf: I liked his humanity and imperial nature here. I wasn't a big fan of Gandalf the Grey -- he was a bit mundane. I did like him more as the White, and even more with the EE stuff.

I want to find Bernard Hill and tell him that the excised Saruman scene wasn't his best one. Sure, it was good, but the death scene and FORTH EORLINGAS!! -- golden and magical. In fact, I think Aragorn's Black Gate speech didn't stand a chance.

Oh god. Theoden yelling "Death!" as the Rohirrim charge into battle is still an automatic crypoint for me. I get all shivery.

Bah. Gandalf does have the palantir when they leave for Minas Tirith. Why did PJ omit all allusions to it? Yeah, he's hallucinating in the EE, but toss in a palantir, and he looks so much more fallen than addled.

Aragorn's palantir definitely comes from Gandalf--the material around it that we see in the Throne Room is the same as the material Gandalf had around it at Edoras . Also, Faramir's lieutenant, Mardil, was killed in exactly the same way in the theatrical release.

Cool info I learned from the commentaries: Gothmog and the Witchking were both played by Lawrence Makaore, but the voices were from Andy Serkis for the Witchking, and Craig Parker (better known as Haldir) for Gothmog.

Not only did Lawrence Makaore play both Gothmog and the Witchking, but, ita, he *was* Lurtz. So he's there, just in a different guise. In one of the commentaries, when he's told he's going to be a Mordor orc, he said, "But they're runty guys! How am I going to play one of those weasly Mordor orcs!"

As for Gothmog's looks, apparently the Weta folks were designing up various faces and put a few lumps on Gothmog. Peter comes through, pauses and says, "He needs more lumps," grabs some latex and sticks it on in various places. "Something like that." So the Weta people, in an effort to find an effect that even Peter will declare over-the-top, just pile on the latex. Peter comes in later, studies it, says, "Just a bit more and he's right."