I don't feel like Wash's death was a slap in the face, since there is plenty of meta evidence that they couldn't get Alan back for more than one movie. His career's taking off and he was one of the last people to sign on for the movie. I don't think Joss would've killed him otherwise.

Yes -- do not forget the meta. Not everything is something done to us. Sometimes it's just done, for reasons we can't see.

But it's easy for me to say. I didn't mind the death even before I had the chance to hear any meta.

Not that I wanted to lose any of the characters (at least not now that Inara's been made quasi-interesting), but I'm less broken up by Wash's demise than I would have been by that of any of the survivors on the Serenity. If it'd been Zoe instead, my enjoyment of the showmovie might have died right along with her.

Yeah, after my "Oh no! Wash!" my next thought was "This doesn't mean you can kill Zoe, you know..."

And sort of like thinking about the Scoobies mourning Buffy after The Gift, it's Zoe's loss that guts me most. But ... Wash isn't coming back, so that's sad in and of itself too.

Wash not coming back resonates strongely for me because of how great and tragic a loss this is for Zoe.

I don't even know that *I* was so pained by his death, so much as it killed me to think of Zoe's reaction and pain. It broke me truly, but it was thinking of how his death would affect others that twisted me so.

Not sure if I should white font this or not, but at the premier Q and A Joss said, with regard to any possible sequel that AT and RG would be back.

I don't feel like Wash's death was a slap in the face, since there is plenty of meta evidence that they couldn't get Alan back for more than one movie.

I guess I wasn't clear--I don't feel, at all, that Wash's death was intended to be a slap in the face. But all the same, that's how it felt to me, and I can't change that. While I was driving home afterwards with my friends (all major fans), one said, "This should feel like a triumphant moment, but all I can feel is grief." It was cruel in the way that, well, life is cruel; it was a reminder that, though we have Serenity, and that's wonderful, we'll never have Firefly again--whatever the reason.

Now, Book's death is a death that only hits the fans. So to speak. No reason a newbie would give a fuck about him. And he didn't need to die for the plot either.

I figured Book's death was meant to be the putative catalyst behind Mal's change of heart, such as it was.

I figured Book's death was meant to be the putative catalyst behind Mal's change of heart, such as it was.

Yeah, but I think that effect could have been achieved with him still alive.

Now, I don't mind his death so much (sad about the untold story, Joss please fix that), but I don't see how Wash's is worse. What Wash's death achieved for me could only have been achieved with a crew death, period. Mal's change of heart could have been achieved with the death and destruction of anything that had been shown to be close to him, but it didn't have to be a show regular.

Mal's change of heart could have been achieved with the death and destruction of anything that had been shown to be close to him, but it didn't have to be a show regular.

Totally. Book didn't *have* to die to spark Mal's change; I just figure that, since Book *did* die, that was the plot-related reason for it.