I'd rather stay home and watch television. It's often funnier than killing stuff.

Anya ,'Dirty Girls'


Natter 68: Bork Bork Bork  

Off-topic discussion. Wanna talk about corsets, duct tape, or physics? This is the place. Detailed discussion of any current-season TV must be whitefonted.


§ ita § - Sep 13, 2011 11:07:19 am PDT #25835 of 30001
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.

I have been on this call since 10:00, except for a ten minute break. I need to break again. Save me.


Lee - Sep 13, 2011 11:07:56 am PDT #25836 of 30001
The feeling you get when your brain finally lets your heart get in its pants.

I am supposed to be doing my time sheets, but my DO NOT WANT TO keeps getting in the way.


Steph L. - Sep 13, 2011 11:08:14 am PDT #25837 of 30001
I look more rad than Lutheranism

Gluten is probably an ish.

Well, I was diagnosed with IBS in 2008, and only puzzled out the gluten thing in 2010 (or 2009? I disremember), and I hoped that the IBS was an incorrect diagnosis, and that avoiding gluten would get rid of all gastrointestinal problems. Unfortunately for me, I still have both -- there are times when I've avoided all gluten for a long time and yet my innards get violent. I don't understand it. But it sucks hard.

On that Miss Manners column, I have a different perspective on part of the first letter:

And while I am a fierce feminist, I do think that a gentleman who holds a door for a lady — or assists her with her coat, or allows her to precede him into a room, or removes his hat indoors — provides a social grace note and shows his consideration for our culture’s rules of polite behavior without doing any actual harm to equality or equal justice.

I generally ask Tim to enter a crowded room in front of me, because my social anxiety gets triggered HARD when I walk in a room and people all turn and yell hi, or whatever. So if I can hide behind him, that helps a small bit.

Granted, I am not typical. But my point is that a truly polite gentleman (or gentlewoman) would find out his (or her) companion's preferences and then accede to them. A stranger watching might think Tim is a boor for preceding me into a room, but to me, he's doing me a tremendous kindness. And in that light, I say, FUCK rules of "polite behavior."


§ ita § - Sep 13, 2011 11:11:01 am PDT #25838 of 30001
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.

I don't get the idea that a man helping a woman with her coat is any more a signifier of a polite society than a woman helping a man with his. Not at all.


DebetEsse - Sep 13, 2011 11:14:28 am PDT #25839 of 30001
Woe to the fucking wicked.

I'ma disagree with Miss Manners on that one. Gender should not be the determinant of who you hold the door for, or who you help with their coat (need? sure. Height? makes sense for the coat thing). I don't find it to be a "social gracenote". I find it to be patronizing.

And Teppy's answer is even better.


Allyson - Sep 13, 2011 11:15:16 am PDT #25840 of 30001
Wait, is this real-world child support, where the money goes to buy food for the kids, or MRA fantasyland child support where the women just buy Ferraris and cocaine? -Jessica

I don't get the idea that a man helping a woman with her coat is any more a signifier of a polite society than a woman helping a man with his. Not at all.

I don't get why there should be a height requirement involved with pulling a trigger.

I'm standing in the ita corner, simultaneously helping a dude take off his jacket while adjusting my holster.


tommyrot - Sep 13, 2011 11:16:33 am PDT #25841 of 30001
Sir, it's not an offence to let your cat eat your bacon. Okay? And we don't arrest cats, I'm very sorry.

A stranger watching might think Tim is a boor for preceding me into a room

Huh. What percentage of strangers think this, do you suppose?

I'll hold a door for a woman if she's right behind me, but I expect the same thing in return. I don't do the coat thing or the hat thing (or the 'help her sit in a restaurant') either. I always figured only a small percentage of people would think I'm a boor....


brenda m - Sep 13, 2011 11:20:06 am PDT #25842 of 30001
If you're going through hell/keep on going/don't slow down/keep your fear from showing/you might be gone/'fore the devil even knows you're there

But my point is that a truly polite gentleman (or gentlewoman) would find out his (or her) companion's preferences and then accede to them

Some of those "polite" things anyway - eh. Any number of times I've been in the middle or back of a crowded elevator, and the men waiting to let me get out first is awkward and inconvenient, and sometimes makes me really self-conscious. And given that no one has regularly helped me on with my coat since about the third grade, that's not exactly devoid of awkwardness either.

I have no issue with common courtesy, but some of it's just silly.


meara - Sep 13, 2011 11:21:27 am PDT #25843 of 30001

I don't find it to be a "social gracenote". I find it to be patronizing.

Eh, I am perfectly happy to have some guy hold the door for me. It just gets weird if he's hardcore about it and he's like, way behind me and running ahead to do it, or if my hands are free and he's got stuff. But then, I also open doors for people sometimes. I figure it's a nice thing to do for a human.

"Help sit in a restaurant" can be nice, if you're wearing a skirt. And a nice restaurant. But that's kind of a rare combo for me (and half the time its the hostess doing that for people, these days, which...)


Lee - Sep 13, 2011 11:24:12 am PDT #25844 of 30001
The feeling you get when your brain finally lets your heart get in its pants.

I figure it's a nice thing to do for a human.

This is pretty much where I am. If not holding the door means it's going to hit someone else in the face or something like that, then I will usually hold the door. I'm not more or less likely to do it based on the gender of the person behind me.