I think it's at least a level complicated in that Dean created a memory so could "deal with his responsibility" for values of deal that include "yelling at you a lot and saying it wasn't his fault."

When someone contrives to be at fault rather than deal with being...abandoned? I think that's a valid reading, given heated arguments he's had many a season. He's not good at people choosing to not be with him, even when he's the last thing they're thinking of.

Which leads me to wonder--does he need to not be the last thing they're thinking of? Is it more important that Sam left him than that Sam didn't stay for him? It's a reading I think the text lets you come at some directions from.

and Dean feeling he's been denied the one thing that could absolve him of his guilt: getting Cas out

So much a mirror of Sam not being able to get Dean out of hell and all his feelings of guilt and responsibilty then. Except I don't expect Dean to start slurping down Benny's vampire blood now.

I think it's at least a level complicated in that Dean created a memory so could "deal with his responsibility" for values of deal that include "yelling at you a lot and saying it wasn't his fault."

Is that what the issue is? That's pretty much how Dean deals with everyone unless they're dying, as far as I can tell. His default behaviors are snark, snapping, and wisecracks.

Vampire blood is a bit been there done that for Dean.

I fully recommend angel blood for all the possible narrative....uh retread of a million fics. But still.

I'm trying to work out how to quantify what Dean needs to be happy vs. what Dean thinks he needs to be happy and what he thinks he deserves and all the levels of self sabotage that lie between them all.

That's pretty much how Dean deals with everyone unless they're dying, as far as I can tell. His default behaviors are snark, snapping, and wisecracks.

Dean believed he had a chance to save Castiel and muffed it, but that's not what happened. How is that similar to his normal coping behaviour? He hasn't hallucinated before without supernatural influence--if we're not ascribing it here (I'm not), then I interpret it as beyond denial or wisecracking to others. He's rewriting history.

Possibly I'm more well-adjusted than I see myself, but who does that? Who needs to remember things such that they're the decision-maker when the decision doesn't go the way they clearly want (or need?) it to?

I'm sorry, I was referring to him snapping at Cas and being less than huggy-joyous when he showed up. I could also be misreading this conversation. I guess I also see Dean as generally cranky anymore, and especially when things aren't going the way he thought they would, good or bad.

I think a lot of people can convince themselves that something happened in a way they can accept, rather than the way it actually happened. Memory is really fluid. And in this case, Dean didn't veer too far from the truth -- he just chose not to remember a few details of it. He didn't turn it into something else altogether, like an alien abduction or a volcano erupting.

But it is a very Dean change. He chose to remember failing Caa rather than what he saw as Cas abandoning him.

As to what Dean needs to be happy. Him and Sam hunting forever, with a homebase safer than Bobby's old safe room so they had a home inbetween hunts. And permanent relationships with women tougher and luckier than they were so that they would each have someone in their life besides each other. In my head canon, Dean would be happy with that. A permanent place, permanent lovers for him and Sam, a safe place in between hunts, but still hunting. I'm not sure if that would be paradise for Sam.

I was referring to him snapping at Cas and being less than huggy-joyous when he showed up

Ah, I see. On a meta level, I figure we weren't getting two Cas hugs in the season (well, series, to be fair) it also totally wasn't the tenor of happy to see him, and in a season where Dean's being pretty snappishly defensive of his right to feel his feels, I got a sense of the not being right with Cas being back was twofold-Dean was the only way out of Purgatory, and he'd failed.

I think a lot of people can convince themselves that something happened in a way they can accept, rather than the way it actually happened

Dean spent 40 years in hell and seemed to remember that correctly. For all the trauma either him or Sam has been through, the text has never shown us any memory modification that wasn't supernatural in nature--either they forgot, or they remember it right, or someone's doing something in their head. And if what we'd been shown had been what happened, I'd have been okay with Cas saying pretty much exactly what he said and thought Dean was being normally OTT about it. But what Cas believes happened (and, even given Naomi I felt we were to treat his version as fact) is sufficiently different that if I ever worked out I'd had that much disparity between a recent memory and an assumed verbatim recollection I'd be engaging in a fair amount of self doubt.

Dean didn't veer too far from the truth -- he just chose not to remember a few details of it

The difference between "our hands slipped" and Cas telling Dean to go isn't s a detail to me. If someone with a big old abandonment issue rewrites a memory to not just take the abandonment part out,, but make them the abandoner, their therapist is going to make a session or two about that.

They could have had Dean's memory of the physicality of it be accurate, but show that Dean couldn't hear Cas over the noise, and I'd take that as convenient filing of something ambiguous. But what happened wasn't ambiguous. It wasn't that close. Dean did some mental legwork on that one. And I feel the script acknowledges that.

I'm rewatching again, and I really want to know what they eat, man. Dean is presumably coming back from a shop run--bag of chips, six pack into the fridge and STUFF. I need fic to get Jossed or Kripked. I need to know what they make, not just what they eat out.

As for Samandriel (Why??? What fucking angel name book are they working from? Balthazar? Naomi? Rachel? Would it be giving too much away to get anywhere near lore?) I think that the show has really got to sort out what angels are vulnerable to and what they're not. Or it'll be like how high Buffy can jump. I mean, I'm okay with him being torturable, I just want to see it being a bit more complex.

(I think I will never not love Sam exorcising his phone)

And permanent relationships with women tougher and luckier than they were so that they would each have someone in their life besides each other

Why permanent? Why not a never ending series of bendy ladies who can hold their liquor?

(To me Dean would rather have a kid than and LD relationship-I'm not seeing that yearning independent of an actual person the way I read it for Sam)

But what happened wasn't ambiguous. It wasn't that close. Dean did some mental legwork on that one. And I feel the script acknowledges that.

Now I'm really not sure where we're disagreeing. If you think the script acknowledges the fact that he changed his memory purposely, what is it you're not buying? That Dean is the type of person who would do that?