That was a very beautiful Sam/Dean vid.

I don't get why creators put in what seems a clearly non platonic gaze in and label it as not having a pairing. The vidder is coy about it in the comments--it's not like the lip licking and the dressing just tripped and fell into the vid.

And I'm not asking because I need my delicacy protected or anything. I'm just really about accurate labelling. Is there not a common "preslash S/D" grouping in the Wincest camp, or is it a personal choice?

I've seen pre-slash used for fic, although not often.

I'm not a huge vid watcher, so I'm not sure what the conventions are in terms of labeling. I know I've seen people clearly label footage that's been manipulated to tell an AU story, but I haven't paid much attention otherwise.

I'm sorry! I should edit my post.

it's not like the lip licking and the dressing just tripped and fell into the vid

and the clutching and touching. Yes, these are all shots from the show, but the closeups are not. The zoom on these moments are not. Maybe it's like the anti-slash rule? Where some people will call a gen fic pre-slash to get the slasher audience? Or maybe the vidder is just hawt for Sam and Dean and was putting in their favorite luscious clips in? Even the song choice is erotic.

Again, nice vid, but am confuzzled about the actual intent.

Amy, it's not you, and it's not offensive. It's the vidder I'm wondering about, who labeled it gen. It's not outrage and getting the dogs out, it's just curiousity and discussion.

Or maybe the vidder is just hawt for Sam and Dean and was putting in their favorite luscious clips in?

the clutching and touching. Yes, these are all shots from the show, but the closeups are not

And neither is the implying of the watching of the dressing and the lip licking. That's put in there on purpose, and that was done with a shippy PoV. There's a fine line of "no more shippy than Show!" but pretty much any time anyone says that (about ANY pairing) they're actually writing pre-slash.

I know on the D/C side in fic pre-slash is used quite a lot. I have a very specific definition for it in my head, and it's probably not a usefully shared one. It's usually when one or both of the pair doesn't understand what they're feeling is non-platonic, and nothing is acted upon, although personal space may be invaded and possessiveness might be demonstrated.

You have to string together a lot of bits from the show to make it pre-slash, and leave a lot of other bits out. It's not the same as Show, not at all. Also, there's no kissing in pre-slash. I've read stuff labelled that that ended in sex. Pre what, people?

Sorry-I have a labelling jones, and I hate when people label their stuff disingenuously. It makes me suspicious of their motivation.

Amy, it's not you, and it's not offensive.

What Julie said. I don't get what the vidder was doing.

Oh, did I mention I also hate the "slashy/Wincesty if you squint!" label? Be honest, and if you're putting in innuendo, own it. Don't act like it's all on the reader to put it there.

It could be a matter of perspective, too. If you've read graphic Wincest, which I have, the vid looks tame? And just brotherly?

Hi, I'm Julie, and . . . I've read graphic Wincest.

::clapping::

I was thinking at first "perspective" based on what we like or what we have or haven't read. I was thinking that because of my having been exposed to S/D slash maybe I was viewing it biased. But, the closeups! The emphasis on lip-licking and glances and touching! The tomfoolery doesn't happen until the final 45 seconds or so, and it's not until then that I sense anything brotherly. Even the hugs are staged as these epic erotic things.

I was wondering if it was because I had a Wincest squick that I was seeing it, but then I figured maybe she's just trying to get it past a jaded audience, one that doesn't really care because they've seen explicit manips et al.

But does being an S/D shipper make you more sensitive to seeing that sort of stuff because you're hungry for it? Being squicked for it means that your antennae are up?

Dunno. But vidder still put them in on purpose.

In completely other news, Annette O'Toole just tweeted this (and SuperWiki retweeted it):

...Sat next to Jensen Ackles on plane home. Reminiscing w/him was SO comforting. What a lovely person he is.

I removed what might have been a spoiler from the beginning. I don't follow Smallville, though, so I have no idea if it was actually spoilery or not.