Angel: He is dead. Technically, he's undead. It's a zombie. Connor: What's a zombie? Angel: It's an undead thing. Connor: Like you? Angel: No, zombies are slow-moving, dimwitted things that crave human flesh. Connor: Like you. Angel: No! It's different. Trust me.

'Destiny'


Boxed Set, Vol. V: Just a Hint of Denial and a Dash of Retcon  

A topic for the discussion of Doctor Who, Arrow, and The Flash. Beware possible invasions of iZombie, Sleepy Hollow, or pretty much any other "genre" (read: sci fi, superhero, or fantasy) show that captures our fancy. Expect adult content and discussion of the Big Gay Sex.

Marvel superheroes are discussed over at the MCU thread.

Whitefont all unaired in the U.S. ep discussion, identifying it as such, and including the show and ep title in blackfont.

Blackfont is allowed after the show has aired on the east coast.

This is NOT a general TV discussion thread.


Juliebird - Jul 05, 2008 4:21:29 pm PDT #3317 of 30001
I am the fly who dreams of the spider

serial DW 4x13

Also I *am* glad that Donna's specialness turned out to be of the timey-wimey variety, and not the mitichlorian variety. But, I have to rewatch, but did they ever address who was manipulating her into place so that she would be there in the right place at the right time?


Torque - Jul 05, 2008 4:21:46 pm PDT #3318 of 30001
Bad Wolf

also, I'm just so incredibly bummed out right now... he just looked so lonely in the rain. And where the hell was Jenny? I totally expected her to crop up somehow that wasn't a flashback.


Polter-Cow - Jul 05, 2008 4:22:12 pm PDT #3319 of 30001
What else besides ramen can you scoop? YOU CAN SCOOP THIS WORLD FROM DARKNESS!

Torque, no, because he didn't actually regenerate.

Julie, I also found Rose's insistence on the Doctor's not changing a little weird, especially because (or maybe even though?) she'd already been through it. It's probably hard to get used to.

Also, Julie, I think it was Dalek Caan who was manipulating things in order to fulfill the future he had seen.

And, Torque, I know! So sad. Even with all these wonderful people, he remains a lonely god.


§ ita § - Jul 05, 2008 4:24:30 pm PDT #3320 of 30001
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.

DW 4x13:

Julie, it was Dalek Caan, although he says it would all have happened anyway.


Juliebird - Jul 05, 2008 4:25:35 pm PDT #3321 of 30001
I am the fly who dreams of the spider

thanks, ita!

DW 4x13 Tennant playing Tate was hysterical!


Vonnie K - Jul 05, 2008 4:41:39 pm PDT #3322 of 30001
Kiss me, my girl, before I'm sick.

The whole "Lonely God" thing makes me alternatively fangirly-swoony and irritated and wanting to bop him on the head, depending on the mood I'm in. I LOVED Latimer's description of the Doctor in Family of Blood. "He's like fire and ice and rage... he burns at the center of time and he can see the turn of the universe." It's a bit OTT but it's also grand and shiver-inducing and awesome. I do love it when he's being alien. But then, occasionally the Lonely God thing translates him into being all emo, and then I roll my eyes a lot.

Re. Rose and Ten: I think the Doctor not saying "I love you" is more of an inability to do so than a refusal. Much as he cares for his companions, he feels incapable of sharing himself enough with anyone to say those words and mean them the way those words are meant in human-to-human interactions -- be that because of his age, the vastness of his experience and the relative ephemerality of his relationships with the human companions, or the damage to his heart(s) he incurred in the wake of the Time War. So Rose accepts human!Ten because he is able to say those words back to her, finally, but even after she kisses him, she keeps looking back to the original Doctor. It's pretty messed-up. I kind of dig it.


DebetEsse - Jul 05, 2008 4:54:42 pm PDT #3323 of 30001
Woe to the fucking wicked.

Which all makes River all the more interesting. I'm thinking we may get her next year, in one or more of the specials.

Someone has to have taken a picture of Everyone on the TARDIS set. I want that picture.


Juliebird - Jul 05, 2008 4:57:24 pm PDT #3324 of 30001
I am the fly who dreams of the spider

Thinking about it, Vonnie, I too kinda like that it's not neat and happily ever after. Rose is fucked up in the choices left to her, the new Doctor is fucked up do to losing a large part of himself, having parts of Donna integrated into himself, and accepting a human life. And I also love that Ten basically said that the new Ten is in the emotional state of Nine. And I love Nine. I don't know when Rose fell in love with the Doctor, but maybe it was with Nine.

I think my one big complaint is that, even as emo as the Doctor can get, I felt a rather lack of emotion during this ep. There were so many epicly, tragically emo moments in the finale, and it was played as numb. And maybe that was the point, that there was so much sensory overload, so much pain, grief (joy at the sight of a long lost loved one) that the body simply couldn't react in any way at all, but then I think that was lost in the camera work/acting/music/directing. Maybe I was expecting Ten to top Nine's spitting anger at seeing a single Dalek, and just lose his shit. Sure, different Doctor, different reaction. Numb just isn't that compelling. Even Rose and Tens reunion(s) left me cold. But I like my emo to be emo

and speaking previously of fucked up characters, sure, in an ideal alternate world, Rose learns to love a human Donna-tainted Doctor and the Doctor accepts being human, we still have the original Ten who still loves Rose and can never ever ever have her. Which is really fucking sad. He's given her up. Sure, another version of himself gets to have her, but he never actually does.

This really reminds me of reading a short series of books featuring Jules Clement or something or other, and the emotional character torture left me wanting nothing more than the character to finally be happy. Ten really needs some light and love and lack of angst, or *I* might up and off myself. How the fuck is this a kids show again?


Juliebird - Jul 05, 2008 5:46:45 pm PDT #3325 of 30001
I am the fly who dreams of the spider

serial:

the TWoP motivator thread lifted my spirits considerably with the SCC musical telenovela, and then i went and watched the DW Confidential and that broke me again, and the use of Portishead's "Roads" didn't help one jot. Broken. Completely. Am going to go suck my thumb now.

And what the hell, where's Lee McAvoy when you need him?!!!


Vonnie K - Jul 05, 2008 5:50:08 pm PDT #3326 of 30001
Kiss me, my girl, before I'm sick.

The Confidential totally lifted music right off my iPod. Not only Portishead, but they used Turin Brakes and Sigur Rós, too. I approve.