Of course, now I want to imagine her named Lilith, and all the cast out of the garden untouchable womanness that implies.

Oh, my. One could go there, if one wanted.

Okay, I *really* have to go do some work, dangit.

Helo as an "ultimate soldier."

Heh. Speaking of not too bright... (Helo, not Tahmoh's SV character.)

She was like Rogue from X-Men, right? Draining other's life force psychically?

She didn't get anything out of it, so I wasn't thinking of her like Rogue. I know they've had a few kill with touch characters in the X Men, but they don't hang out long and don't get names.

Actually, I'm not sure why any of them thought that they could get out. Why wouldn't the YED prevent them from leaving or just bring them back everytime they escaped? It's not like they were able to keep themselves from being abducted in the first place. Perhaps what happened to Ava was that she realized that she could never escape and rather than be killed - got good at winning the game.

blacks are treacherous thing is news to me

I want to clarify that when I initially stated this stereotype I stated it as minorities in general, which is where it comes from for me. It is always possible that I am projecting, because Japanese are treacherous definitely is an existing one. But what I was referring to at the time was "You can't trust that group of people Other than me" which I've heard in various incarnations.

"You can't trust that group of people Other than me"

This is an idea way older than TV.

signed, took a course in college on The Other in Music

t /not sure that has any bearing on current discussion

But what I was referring to at the time was "You can't trust that group of people Other than me" which I've heard in various incarnations.

I do dig that. But that's not even about race to me--that's about boundary setting and team building and enemy identification. There's no difference for me seeing a black guy do it from a white guy, not with the lines he was handed. I could see it written so that it's a black guy who can't trust a white guy not to throw him under the bus, but that's a reverse from what you're noting.

Aha. I think what I'm saying is that not only do I not see it applying any better to the demographics represented in SPN last night than many other demographics, it also doesn't correlate with any particular power differential in any direction. So it has no resonance for me.

Okay. That makes sense to me.

I didn't realize Lily was a lesbian until I read it here.

I think I saw Jake the same way Sail did.

Well, she said something about touching her girlfriend.