This is quite a conversation to drop into just as the communists are leaving town.

People say adoption is horrible? WTF?

Got no advice for meara, but yay for having a fun reason taking up your time!

Parenting does *not* force all parents to grow.

agreed. I have a lot to say , but they are DH's parents. But I will say that 90% of what is good, wonderful and kind is due to his own efforts to become an adult and not get stuck in his parent's world. I give his parents credit for showing him what not to be. They are not evil, in fact I enjoy talking with them there are things I really ike about them. His mom, for example, would never turn a hungry person away. She might lecture them, but she would feed them well. And his dad has never lost his intellectual curiosity. and they gave the world Matt, so I can forgive them for a lot.

Yay meara!

People with kids DO have lives of their own.

Some of my friends in PA, all stay-at-home moms, used to say to me all the time, with regard to my writing and freelance income and occasional trips into NYC to deal with same, "You're so lucky you get to have a real life!" And that just astounded me -- being a mom to my kids is very much part of my *real* life. I felt like telling them that if they were still waiting to have a *real* life (at some unspecified point, maybe when the kids were allschool-age), they were missing something.

Life is what you make it. I'm self-aware enough to know that, although I certainly would have fed and diapered and loved twins, *having* twins, or babies within a year or two of each other would have made me really unhappy. I'm self-aware enough to know that I like having outside work and interests, and I'm fortunate that I have a husband who understands and supports that. (And I knew a lot of women whose husbands don't.)

I think selfishness gets conflated with self-awareness much of the time.

I'm not so much a commitmentphobe, but yeah. If you want this to last, I think you might need to put the brakes on a bit.

Erm. Never having had to do that before, and keeping in mind that I am basically ENJOYING all the time spent together, just...a little freaked out by it, and by the concept of all of it....how does one DO that, put the brakes on??

I think selfishness gets conflated with self-awareness much of the time.

Exactly.

but not because that sort of "selfishness" will make you a bad parent. I think that, because it can make you an unhappy parent.

and I think that is where I would have been. Now if Matt had been home more - less travel or crazy hours , I might not have been unhappy. At one point, when Matt was working for a VC - some of the partners were too curious about when wew were going to have children. Matt was comming home between 10 and 12 4 out of 5 nights. My answers - which was said in a lighthearted way (but I was very serious) was, 'when Matt is home more '. I know me- I am happy all alone and really need alone time. I think I would have survived the infant stage , but the clingly toddler stage might have driven me insane.

Homely Dateless Bitch

Save room on that bench for me, erika.

I don't even know that I'm ready for a pet yet. I'm not past the "not killing your houseplants" stage.

I don't know, meara, if you're enjoying the ride I don't think you need to apply brakes. Worry about the baggage when it becomes a problem.

meara, I was a commitmentphobe until I met Greg, and then it was all over. I've never been able to put brakes on, so no advice from me. I hope it works out for you both.

I've been reading along and enjoying the thoughtful conversation. Probably the worst stuff I've gotten re: children is "Wow, you sure waited a long time between!" when they find out how old Nick is. And one lovely person denying I could possibly be the mother of a 21 year old. I did get funny looks when I told Aidan's teacher he was sick and cranky and she said, "poor baby" and I said, "you won't say that when he kicks you."

I always said I would adopt if I had no children of my own, and my mom always said that stuff about adoption being fraught with peril and so forth. I still think about it sometimes, though, and yet, I don't think I'm a particularly good mother. I think I'm an acceptable one, and sometimes I think I was selfish to have them because I wanted them, without thinking about how much it would cost in my own health, money, time, desires and energy. It wasn't until after I had Aidan that it sunk in that I'd be a good person even if I'd never had children. That was a weird moment for me.

I have felt guilty about wanting kids (biologically my own) when the world is overpopulated way more than I have felt guilty about not having kids. But I've always wanted kids, so that colors how I interpret other people's expectations, I'm sure.