Abstain means you AREN'T VOTING, hence your vote isn't counted in the total. Or what, are we gonna have our own special meaning for the term?
The issue is -- is there a difference from submitting an ABSTAIN and just not showing up?
Remember that sex we were planning to have, ever again?
Zoe ,'Our Mrs. Reynolds'
Bureaucracy 1: Like Kafka, Only Funnier
A thread to discuss naming threads, board policy, new thread suggestions, and anything else that has to do with board administration and maintenance. Guaranteed to include lively debate and polls. Natter discouraged, but not deleted.
Current Stompy Feet: ita, Jon B, DXMachina, P.M. Marcontell, Liese S., amych
§ ita § - Mar 03, 2003 9:41:02 pm PST #6470 of 10001
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.
Burrell - Mar 03, 2003 9:41:24 pm PST #6471 of 10001
Why did Darth Vader cross the road? To get to the Dark Side!
How about we deal with the MVT question first?
How about not now? Seriously. How many people have to register their frustration before it gets recognized?
John H - Mar 03, 2003 9:41:33 pm PST #6472 of 10001
I'd recommend TAKING A WEEK OFF from both discussions and voting.
I'd support that myself if other people wanted it.
We always knew we might have to decide the MVT issue though, going in.
We decided to have a vote for "MVT required", and a vote-off for the actual number if it passed.
Sophia Brooks - Mar 03, 2003 9:41:47 pm PST #6473 of 10001
Cats to become a rabbit should gather immediately now here
Oh jeez, now we need to define the definition of abstain too?!? Abstain means you AREN'T VOTING, hence your vote isn't counted in the total. Or what, are we gonna have our own special meaning for the term?
That was sort of my point. It doesn't seem like people understand this, since they think it should count.
Burrell - Mar 03, 2003 9:42:48 pm PST #6474 of 10001
Why did Darth Vader cross the road? To get to the Dark Side!
The issue is -- is there a difference from submitting an ABSTAIN and just not showing up?
From the point of view of the vote count? No. From the point of view of the MVT? That's up for debate. But the meaning of abstaining remains the same--it's not a vote.
Jon B. - Mar 03, 2003 9:43:55 pm PST #6475 of 10001
A turkey in every toilet -- only in America!
I would like to respectfully point out that if we go with a preferential ballot, then we can include 10 and 65 as two of the options, and those who would prefer a deathmatch can put those two options as their first two choices. Those who don't like those options can choose something else.
What I think is getting lost is that a preferential vote is just like reaching a consensus. Except that everyone gets to participate, not just the poeple who happen to be around at the time.
John H - Mar 03, 2003 9:49:16 pm PST #6476 of 10001
From the point of view of the vote count? No. From the point of view of the MVT? That's up for debate. But the meaning of abstaining remains the same--it's not a vote.
Yes, but in the particular case of abstainers counting toward MVT, it's like raising your hand and saying "present -- but I abstain".
Sophia Brooks - Mar 03, 2003 9:50:47 pm PST #6477 of 10001
Cats to become a rabbit should gather immediately now here
Taking a week off is probably good, although we knew we would have to vote on all these things once the votes come through.
However, is there any way we can do some sort of vote on the Buffy/Angel whitefont policy thing that we were discussing before this started? Even if we don't agree on how to count the votes? We may not get to it before Buffy is over....
on edit--
Or just deal with the question in some way. I hate to see this voting stuff get in the way of making the board function.
Jon B. - Mar 03, 2003 10:05:28 pm PST #6478 of 10001
A turkey in every toilet -- only in America!
Sophia -- While the discussion was going on during the first round of voting, I proposed that we just institute the one-week-Buffy/Angel-whitefont thing, since I thought we'd reached consensus. Several folks said no -- that we should wait until the voting scheme is decided. I wonder if folks still want to wait?
DavidS - Mar 03, 2003 10:07:20 pm PST #6479 of 10001
"Look, son, if it's good enough for Shirley Bassey, it's good enough for you."
Okay.
Several people have registered their discomfort with pushing another vote forward at this point or even discussing the voting issues right now.
For the people still interested in forging ahead, I'll just ask, one more time, stop and look at the people who are uncomfortable. Do you value them in the community? I do. Then try to register that this very process is alienating them, and feels counter to their expectations about the board. Even if you can't understand why they feel that way, just let the knowledge that it is that way sit with you for second. Even if you feel strongly that we are so close and we could nail everything down now, I am telling you that we are on the verge of everything sliding away. More forward momentum could send us down the slope.
We may need some time off from the voting or discussing it. I do hear Sophia's point that the spoiler/xover/whiteout issue between the Buffy and Angel threads is time sensitive. But I am hearing and feeling "critical irritation mass" coming on. If the point of establishing the voting is to ease friction, then let us keep that in mind now. Because I'm seeing friction. And resentment. The first vote and the consensus around it seems tenuous to me now and I would ask you all to hold on to it...gently. A little time and space might be good here.