Okay, um, I'm lost. Uh, I'm angry, and I'm armed, so if you two have something that you need to work out --

Mal ,'War Stories'


Bureaucracy 1: Like Kafka, Only Funnier  

A thread to discuss naming threads, board policy, new thread suggestions, and anything else that has to do with board administration and maintenance. Guaranteed to include lively debate and polls. Natter discouraged, but not deleted.

Current Stompy Feet: ita, Jon B, DXMachina, P.M. Marcontell, Liese S., amych


DavidS - Feb 27, 2003 4:24:18 pm PST #5901 of 10001
"Look, son, if it's good enough for Shirley Bassey, it's good enough for you."

The reasons I support voting are that it will be easier to have a time limited discussion and even if people are upset by an outcome, they can CLEARLY SEE that they were outnumbered. This is why I think we have to work very hard to keep every vote understandable and as free of bureacratize as possible AND to keep the results transparent to math-phobes.

wants to kiss Sophia and buy her chocolate


Hil R. - Feb 27, 2003 4:25:34 pm PST #5902 of 10001
Sometimes I think I might just move up to Vermont, open a bookstore or a vegan restaurant. Adam Schlesinger, z''l

Some people wanted 1 week, some the weekend, some 2 weeks, some "until the next show".

I think that 1 week, the weekend, and "until the next show" were pretty much equivalent. People clarified "until the next show" to mean "until when the next show ought to be," which is equivalent to one week. The way I'd see it working would be, someone could propose that it get changed to one week. It gets discussed, a lot of people think that's too short a time, and gets voted down. Then, someone could propose two weeks, and we could discuss the pros and cons of that without having to deal with trying to figure out the time frame at the same time as trying to figure out whether we want it changed at all.

edit:

Voter turnout was one such item mentioned: if we come to set an actual number, we may want more options than just 0 or 50 (for instance).

I mentioned that in my original post as something that could be decided later if we end up needing to decide it. I don't really see why we need to decide on how we'll choose a number if we don't know yet that we're going to need to choose a number anyway.


jengod - Feb 27, 2003 4:26:05 pm PST #5903 of 10001

Also, for the imaginary future ballot we figure this out on... Quorum, defined as the number of vote (not voters) necessary to make a ballot valid, is:

1.) 10
2.) 25
3.) 50
4.) 100
5.) Abstain
6.) Write-in #: X

edit: sorry! was doing some self-editing, to keep things simple! 7) 8) were 5) 6)


Wolfram - Feb 27, 2003 4:27:25 pm PST #5904 of 10001
Visilurking

And options 5) and 6) are butterflied off.

Dammit, the edit ate my punchline.


Typo Boy - Feb 27, 2003 4:28:43 pm PST #5905 of 10001
Calli: My people have a saying. A man who trusts can never be betrayed, only mistaken.Avon: Life expectancy among your people must be extremely short.

Example where we would want more that two or even three choices:

If we wanted quora, the number that constitutes a quorum. (and for that matter whether we use a number or percentage, and whether we revise the number periodically.)

If we want seconds, a similar question arises.

If we reject majority voting, the size of the super-majority.

The meta-question of how we handle questions which are not subject to a binary yes/no answer. Because there are at lease three possible answers.

A) Plurality

B) run-off

C) preference voting.

So that in itself is a non-binary question.

In short it is extremely likely that during this process we will end up confronting at least one question we can't answer with a single yes or no.


Typo Boy - Feb 27, 2003 4:30:29 pm PST #5906 of 10001
Calli: My people have a saying. A man who trusts can never be betrayed, only mistaken.Avon: Life expectancy among your people must be extremely short.

And Jengods example above is a perfect case for preference voting.


§ ita § - Feb 27, 2003 4:31:04 pm PST #5907 of 10001
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.

You know the thing, with the making people dizzy? I think you're still doing it, FWIW.

I understand the exercise, and the motivation, but if I were coming in to vote now, I'd be more tempted to vote against further voting than I would have been yesterday.


Hil R. - Feb 27, 2003 4:31:20 pm PST #5908 of 10001
Sometimes I think I might just move up to Vermont, open a bookstore or a vegan restaurant. Adam Schlesinger, z''l

I was under the impression that thread names were seperate from this process.


Typo Boy - Feb 27, 2003 4:32:37 pm PST #5909 of 10001
Calli: My people have a saying. A man who trusts can never be betrayed, only mistaken.Avon: Life expectancy among your people must be extremely short.

OK shutting up now.


Wolfram - Feb 27, 2003 4:32:47 pm PST #5910 of 10001
Visilurking

I was under the impression that thread names were seperate from this process.

Thread names - yes New threads - no