Well some friends of Buffy played a funny joke and they took her stuff and now she wants us to help get it back from her friends who sleep all day and have no tans.

Xander ,'Lessons'


Natter 42, the Universe, and Everything  

Off-topic discussion. Wanna talk about corsets, flaming otters, or physics? This is the place. Detailed discussion of any current-season TV must be whitefonted.


Gudanov - Feb 01, 2006 8:02:10 am PST #4188 of 10002
Coding and Sleeping

Some stuff about opposing stem cell research and abortion and then summing up a call to fight AIDs especially in the black community, well the church-going black community at least. Then the pretty standard upbeat wrap-up.

Sorry about the longness, I just wanted to share some thoughts about it.


tommyrot - Feb 01, 2006 8:03:34 am PST #4189 of 10002
Sir, it's not an offence to let your cat eat your bacon. Okay? And we don't arrest cats, I'm very sorry.

In defense of chimeras:

[link]

I'm getting a lot of "WTF?" email about this statement from Bush:

Tonight I ask you to pass legislation to prohibit the most egregious abuses of medical research, human cloning in all its forms, creating or implanting embryos for experiments, creating human-animal hybrids, and buying, selling or patenting human embryos.

It's pure political calculus. He throws away the mad scientist and pig-man vote, and wins the religious ignoramus vote…and we know which one has the majority here.

But guess what? Creating chimeras is legitimate and useful scientific research; it's really happening. Of course, it isn't with the intent of creating monstrous half-animal/half-human slaves or something evil like that, and scientists are well aware (or should be well aware) of the ethical concerns, and it's the topic of ongoing debate. Let's consider one recent example of such an experiment.

Down syndrome is a very common genetic disorder caused by the presence of an extra chromosome 21. That kind of genetic insult causes a constellation of problems: mild to moderate mental retardation, heart defects, and weakened immune systems, and various superficial abnormalities. It's also a viable defect, and produces walking, talking, interacting human beings who are loved by their friends and families, who would really like to be able to do something about those lifespan-reducing health problems. We would love to have an animal model of Down syndrome, so that, for example, we could figure out exactly what gene overdose is causing the immune system problems or the heart defects, and develop better treatments for them.

So what scientists have been doing is inserting human genes into mice, to produce similar genetic overdoses in their development. As I reported before, there have been partial insertions, but now a team of researchers has inserted a complete human chromosome 21 into mouse embryonic stem cells, and from those generated a line of aneuploid mice that have many of the symptoms of Down syndrome, including the heart defects. They also have problems in spatial learning and memory that have been traced back to defects in long-term potentiation in the central nervous system.

These mice are a tool to help us understand a debilitating human problem.

George W. Bush would like to make them illegal.


DavidS - Feb 01, 2006 8:04:24 am PST #4190 of 10002
"Look, son, if it's good enough for Shirley Bassey, it's good enough for you."

that it's not vague "injuries" they're talking about, but traumatic brain injury.

He's not going to be an anchorperson anymore.


Gudanov - Feb 01, 2006 8:05:48 am PST #4191 of 10002
Coding and Sleeping

Creating chimeras is legitimate and useful scientific research; it's really happening. Of course, it isn't with the intent of creating monstrous half-animal/half-human

Well, speak for yourself.

Seriously, that's a good point though. There is some valuable research at risk. One of the reasons for splicing human DNA into animal cells is to skirt around having to use human stem cells (I think there is some research to that purpose, but I don't have a source at the moment)


Jessica - Feb 01, 2006 8:09:05 am PST #4192 of 10002
And then Ortus came and said "It's Ortin' time" and they all Orted off into the sunset

it isn't with the intent of creating monstrous half-animal/half-human

"Monstrous" is such a loaded word. Can't we just call them Chimeran-Americans?


Sue - Feb 01, 2006 8:09:12 am PST #4193 of 10002
hip deep in pie

On CBS last night, they covered Woodruff and Vogt returning to the US, and they mentioned they were only two of about 24 injured people on being transported on the flight (the rest being injured military people) and that there's flights like that all the time (weekly, I think was the word they used). Very sobering.


tommyrot - Feb 01, 2006 8:10:04 am PST #4194 of 10002
Sir, it's not an offence to let your cat eat your bacon. Okay? And we don't arrest cats, I'm very sorry.

Well, speak for yourself.

Hush. They have to say that, to maintain public support. But in their secret meetings and isolated research facilities (such as the one run by Dr Moreau) they can be more open about their goals.


JZ - Feb 01, 2006 8:11:50 am PST #4195 of 10002
See? I gave everybody here an opportunity to tell me what a bad person I am and nobody did, because I fuckin' rule.

Sorry about the longness, I just wanted to share some thoughts about it.

Gud, I appreciated it all hugely.

I have my doubts about this. I suspect when it comes to funding the idea will wither away.

Yuh. My eyes were already rolling forever, but this is where they fell right out of my head. The basic science research, the 70,000 new teachers, the this and that and the other, all simultaneous with the $14 billion permanent tax cut. I can't quite see how he expects to manage it unless he just plans to take advantage of being Commander in Chief of the US Mint and print a shitload more money, and that way lies betwixt-wars Germany, with people trundling a wheelbarrow of paper money to the grocer for a loaf of bread.

Also, you know, what Dana said, about the devastation of the Gulf Coast and the destruction of New Orleans and the total fucking lack of accountability and total fucking lack of interest in any serious attempt to make any of it better.

Blarg. Now my stomach hurts.


flea - Feb 01, 2006 8:12:09 am PST #4196 of 10002
information libertarian

I think it's too early to tell about Woodruff, based on what they've told the public. Until the man wakes up and they can do some diagnostics, they can only make the vaguest of guesses. I mean, so far all they know is he can feel in his extremities and his brain isn't swollen any more (which is good, it went down fast). Whether he'll have to relearn to walk and talk is a question for a couple of weeks from now. The brain is tricksy, and some people with shockwave trauma only, no wounds, have serious problems, whereas there was some historical guy who took an iron bar through the head and seemed unaffected.

Vogt seems to be doing okay, on the other hand.


Gudanov - Feb 01, 2006 8:12:36 am PST #4197 of 10002
Coding and Sleeping

On CBS last night, they covered Woodruff and Vogt returning to the US, and they mentioned they were only two of about 24 injured people on being transported on the flight (the rest being injured military people) and that there's flights like that all the time (weekly, I think was the word they used). Very sobering.

I believe that for every lethal casualty in Iraq there are about 10 non-lethal casualties.