What I'm asking about is what you guys based your read on his fathering sitch from his character, not what untapped studies said.

It doesn't seem worth elaborating on since (a) I was wrong, and (b) I don't know how to discuss it without looking over my shoulder for Anya to come swooping in and putting her gender studies-fu on me. Besides, I think the canonical backstory on Mal provides for plenty of male role models which would account for what I was seeing. He had a lot of adult men in his life, but Mom was #1.

Well, you're probably safe from Anya. Me, I don't know what a) invested in male culture really means b) how Mal demonstrated that and in a far distant third position c) how closely tied that is to non-fictitious parenting.

So that's what I was wondering about.

OK. I don't know anything about psychological studies. I raised a boy, but it was with the assistance of a strong woman.

OK. "Assistance" is too strong. She raised him. I occasionally played b-ball with him,giving him the ego-boost of trouncing my academic tushy.

I'm gonna mix Beverly and ita's speculation on Zoe and say that perhaps her family was the security end of a formal household. Training in being both deadly and polite.

I don't think so, aurelia. She doesn't strike me as someone raised to service the "those people right there" (which is different from a general "service" ethos)

I'm not really thinking of it as "service" so much as a culture in which security is both necessary and highly regarded.

How about an artificial station or colony in a hostile environment for Zoe? A dangerous enviroment could leave the culture very conscious of both rank and ability.

She could have been raised in something like a gender-equitable Barrayar.

gender-equitable Barrayar ...

Zoe is Elena Bothari! I knew it!

I could definitely see Zoe in a military family. But she also does have quite a bearing of authority, although not necessarily the need to be top dog. Government otherwise, maybe?