The song's pretty cool, too.

I love the song. But I'm a huge NIN fan.

Hmmm.... that makes me think... in the last year and a half I've bought a bunch of albums from iTunes. I just realized that for most all of those bands I have no idea what they look like - or anything else, for that matter.

I love the song. But I'm a huge NIN fan.

I was listening to Pretty Hate Machine the other day, and was struck by just how ... poppy it sounded. Sulky and angry, yes, but undeniably pop music.

'Cuz it's supposed to be about the music, man!

There's a strong bias that music shouldn't get over on visuals. That, in fact, most crap music and the most commercial pop, sell because Britney's belly is bare or like that. It's a very strongly held notion in punk/indie orthodoxy that videos are evil, 'mersh, cheezy, inauthentic, corporate.

Sulky and angry, yes, but undeniably pop music.

That album is pretty poppy, yeah, with all the deets and doots. The rest of his oeuvre, I don't see the pop so much. Of course, I don't really know what the hell "poppy" is supposed to mean.

Is "March of the Pigs" poppy? What about "Starfuckers, Inc."?

Whoa, if you look at the word "poppy" enough, it starts to look like "poopy."

It's a very strongly held notion in punk/indie orthodoxy that videos are evil, 'mersh, cheezy, inauthentic, corporate.

Hmmph. But don't they realize that videos are another way to get your complete artistic philosophy across? And that the rabidly-devoted fans want a way to see their musical heros even if they can't get to a show?

I suspect this is part of the reason a lot of punk & "indie" musicians sneer at goth bands. Just about every goth (or goth-ish) band likes the idea of videos. Which reminds me, I need to see if I can track down the video compilation released at the same time as the Cleopatra Records Goth Bible CD set.

I suspect this is part of the reason a lot of punk & "indie" musicians sneer at goth bands.

Oh, it's definitely a part of it. It's seen as an indicator of shallowness.

It's a very strongly held notion in punk/indie orthodoxy that videos are evil, 'mersh, chee

Oh, that reminds me. For the longest time The Replacements swore they'd never do a video. Then they did one (for "Bastards of Young", right?) that was just a single shot of a stereo speaker and a guy's leg. Cracked me the hell up when I first saw it. I didn't know who The Replacemetns were at the time, but I admired their balls....

For the longest time The Replacements swore they'd never do a video. Then they did one (for "Bastards of Young", right) that was just a single shot of a stereo speaker and a guy's leg. Cracked me the hell up when I first saw it. I didn't know who The Replacemetns were at the time, but I admired their balls....

This is, of course, the most famous example of this mindset. And while at the time, I admired it, now I think it's a bit precious. Because they sure as fuck did videos after that, so they didn't stay pure for too damn long. And it's not like Paul Westerberg didn't have a preening, dandyish side. He may have worn flannel shirts and chuck taylors, but he went through about a can of Aquanet a day in the early 80s.

It's seen as an indicator of shallowness.

Well hurrah for shallow goth bands! Give me fog machines, elaborate eye makeup, and some sort of ruined castle background, thankyouverymuch.