It took more than Simon to carry around that giant cryo tank in "Serenity," didn't it?
It's simple. I slap 'em around a bit, torture 'em, make their lives hell...Sure, the nice guys'll run away,but every now and then you'll find a prince like Spike who gets off on it.
Buffy ,'Get It Done'
Firefly Spoilers
Discussion of all Firefly episodes, including "Trash", "The Message", "Heart of Gold", and any movie news.
Matt the Bruins fan - Sep 04, 2005 5:21:53 pm PDT #1202 of 1424
"I remember when they eventually introduced that drug kingpin who murdered people and smuggled drugs inside snakes and I was like 'Finally. A normal person.'” —RahvinDragand
Kalshane - Sep 04, 2005 7:18:27 pm PDT #1203 of 1424
GS: If you had to choose between kicking evil in the head or the behind, which would you choose, and why?
Minsc: I'm not sure I understand the question. I have two feet, do I not? You do not take a small plate when the feast of evil welcomes seconds.
But if she's awake and active when he breaks her out, why bother putting her into Cryo in the first place? Wouldn't it be easier and less conspicuous to not have to cart a humongous box around?
Simon's behavior in "Serenity" the episode, seems very much like he's not aware there's a warrant for his arrest yet. He's using his real name, openly discussing where he used to work and what he used to do. If he had broken into an Alliance facility and knowingly ended up with his face on their security monitors, I think he would have tried to be a little more low-profile.
I'm also still bugged by the fact that I just can't see early Simon pulling off that kind of deception. But that could just be me.
Mr. Broom - Sep 04, 2005 10:07:58 pm PDT #1204 of 1424
"When I look at people that I would like to feel have been a mentor or an inspiring kind of archetype of what I'd love to see my career eventually be mentioned as a footnote for in the same paragraph, it would be, like, Bowie." ~Trent Reznor
He's got to have known there was a warrant out. Getting his sister out of a government facility isn't going to happen without someone branding him an outlaw for it. Otherwise it'd be a matter of signing for her and thank you, good day. I'd say he uses his real name and credentials in "Serenity" the episode because he's on a mid-bulk transport ship on his way to the outer rings, with no reason to believe he has to deceive anyone directly right this moment.
As for the deception, I see it as being entirely in keeping with his character, even in regard to "Serenity" the episode. As long as you appear to be in a station whose particulars would not be known to the people around you and as long as you maintain that bearing, people won't ask questions. Basically, people will obey anyone who appears uppity enough. It's proven true in real life, so I have no problem with Simon using it to his advantage. If you act like what you are, you don't have to do any further acting.
Kiba Rika - Sep 05, 2005 2:41:15 am PDT #1205 of 1424
I may have to seize the cat.
But if she's awake and active when he breaks her out, why bother putting her into Cryo in the first place? Wouldn't it be easier and less conspicuous to not have to cart a humongous box around?
According to the novelization, since he was posing as an inspector he had to fly an inspector's ship. And an inspector's ship has room for one person. And it has a cryo chamber. This was "the only place for River" on the ship. Also, it made it easy for him to wander about Persephone looking for a boat, because doctor with big box is less sketchy than doctor with crazy girl, apparently.
It's not a perfect explanation, but it eases my mind some. My fanwank for the deception (since we saw Simon being so bad at it in Jaynestown but so good at it in Ariel) is that a) the people he funded coached him on how to behave and b) Simon is much more comfortable in an academic or medical facility than in mudpits.
I can believe that Simon, being rather inexperienced in successful attempts to break people out, would believe and obey anything the people from the organization helping him get River out told him, but might not consider it farther than that and thus not do things they thought obvious - like, for example, use a fake name on Persephone.
Cass - Sep 05, 2005 10:05:13 am PDT #1206 of 1424
Bob's learned to live with tragedy, but he knows that this tragedy is one that won't ever leave him or get better.
It's not a perfect explanation, but it eases my mind some.Thanks for posting this, Kiba. It's not a perfect explantion, true. But since the show said what show said, and then movie said what the movie said, having some way to reconcile them together is nice.
Gandalfe - Sep 05, 2005 12:30:33 pm PDT #1207 of 1424
The generation that could change the world is still looking for its car keys.
My fanwank for the deception (since we saw Simon being so bad at it in Jaynestown but so good at it in Ariel) is that a) the people he funded coached him on how to behave and b) Simon is much more comfortable in an academic or medical facility than in mudpits.
Plus, the deception in Jaynestown was sprung on him, and was not his idea whatsoever.
Nutty - Sep 06, 2005 4:47:12 pm PDT #1208 of 1424
"Mister Spock is on his fanny, sir. Reports heavy damage."
Am I wrong, or is it understood that Simon does not know what is in the box until it is opened? That was always my impression.
If he is only crossing his fingers that Big Scary Box contains his sister, then he cannot have seen her into it in the first place. If he is the one who put her into it, then his only point of dreadful uncertainty should be whether or not she is still alive in it. (Or, I suppose, in a Marx Brothers world, whether his Big Scary Box was switched with that of someone smuggling crawdads in bulk.)
Kalshane - Sep 06, 2005 5:06:56 pm PDT #1209 of 1424
GS: If you had to choose between kicking evil in the head or the behind, which would you choose, and why?
Minsc: I'm not sure I understand the question. I have two feet, do I not? You do not take a small plate when the feast of evil welcomes seconds.
I never had that impression, Nutty. While I have issues with him putting on the ruse and effecting River's escape himself, I can't see him giving people money to rescue his sister and then leaving it on faith that they big box they gave him had her inside. Plus, nothing in his demeanor suggests to me he has any doubts about the box's content.
Michele T. - Sep 06, 2005 5:27:33 pm PDT #1210 of 1424
with a gleam in my eye, and an almost airtight alibi
It was pretty clear to me that Simon knew River was in the box.
And, to be fair to Serenity's version of the rescue, his unwillingness to defrost her could be read as him knowing how badly she'd been messed with, which it's hard to think he'd believe if he hadn't seen it in person.
Gandalfe - Sep 06, 2005 8:50:29 pm PDT #1211 of 1424
The generation that could change the world is still looking for its car keys.
Plus, there may be medical reasons not to refreeze someone for a certain period of time after they thaw out, or that the box was a one time use thing. And, of course, it's easier to travel with a big box than a crazy, psychic, ninja-groove trained assasin. Which, yes, could have been explained with a throwaway line, but, hey, what's the fun of that?