Willow, check you out! Witch-Fu!

Buffy ,'Lessons'


Buffy 4: Grr. Arrgh.  

This is where we talk about Buffy the Vampire Slayer! No spoilers though?if you post one by accident, an admin will delete it. This thread is NO LONGER NAFDA. Please don't discuss current Angel events here.


Frankenbuddha - May 17, 2003 10:26:04 pm PDT #544 of 10001
"We are the Goon Squad and we're coming to town...Beep! Beep!" - David Bowie, "Fashion"

OK - Now I'm hearing MY ANGELUS to the tune of MY SHIRONA.

This is not a good thing.


Jon B. - May 18, 2003 12:17:50 am PDT #545 of 10001
A turkey in every toilet -- only in America!

Listening to last week's Succubus Club: Jane said that Joss wrote the Holden segment and Marti wrote the Willow segment. Not doctored -- wrote.


Jon B. - May 18, 2003 12:23:32 am PDT #546 of 10001
A turkey in every toilet -- only in America!

Also - She's saying that the Bringers have a hive mind. If one Bringer knows something, they all know something. So when the gang got the Bringer to talk, all the Bringers (and by extension, the First) knew what the plan was going to be and they could set up a trap at the arsenal.


victor infante - May 18, 2003 12:23:43 am PDT #547 of 10001
To understand what happened at the diner, we shall use Mr. Papaya! This is upsetting because he's the friendliest of fruits.

Jane said that Joss wrote the Holden segment and Marti wrote the Willow segment. Not doctored -- wrote.

I think they indicated as much before, actually, but that Joss and Marti left their names off the credits. I guess that means that Jane wrote the Spike bits, and Dru the Jonathan/Andrew bits.


Jon B. - May 18, 2003 12:24:22 am PDT #548 of 10001
A turkey in every toilet -- only in America!

Jane wrote the Dawn segment.


victor infante - May 18, 2003 12:25:44 am PDT #549 of 10001
To understand what happened at the diner, we shall use Mr. Papaya! This is upsetting because he's the friendliest of fruits.

Jane wrote the Dawn segment.

Ah. Knew I was forgetting something.


Jon B. - May 18, 2003 12:47:54 am PDT #550 of 10001
A turkey in every toilet -- only in America!

At the end of the Succubus Club show, Drew Greenberg talked about the Dead Lesbian Cliché. The usual stuff -- how he felt that they were subverting the cliché rather than promoting it. But he also expressed frustration that none of the Gay press that wrote articles lambasting the show ever contacted him (the only openly gay writer on the show) to get his viewpoint. I can see how that would rankle.


SailAweigh - May 18, 2003 1:53:24 am PDT #551 of 10001
Nana korobi, ya oki. (Fall down seven times, stand up eight.) ~Yuzuru Hanyu/Japanese proverb

Okay, not to reopen what appears to be a closed argument, but I'd kind of like to give my take on the "show" vs. "tell" aspect of this season. I am not a screenwriter, nor am I an author of any type of fiction. I do not have any basis to develop a critical breakdown of the writing this season from an informed viewpoint of what makes good or bad television. My background is probably in direct opposition to most people here. But I still have my own opinion on this season's storyline and how well it worked for me, and that is based on a (semi)professional analysis of another sort. My background is in anthropology and classical studies. When I look back at this season, I see a classical epic poem. Epics weren't shown, they were told. Epic poetry developed from storytelling. We know this because of the way the earliest epics (e.g. Homer's Illiad) uses repetious language as a memory device. We still find it in poetry and music. Poe's "The Raven" wouldn't be nearly as interesting or emotional if it didn't have the repeatedly stressed refrain of "quoth the Raven, Nevermore." The constant repetition builds resonance over the course of the poem such that whether you remember the words or not, you're left with a feeling which you can't simply shrug off. The feelings and the word picture remain in your memory long after you finish reading the poem.

t sappiness alert

This, for me, is where this season has worked. The episode "Storyteller" spelled it out explicitly. Besides being the story of Andrew's first steps toward redemption, it spells out the entire premise of this season, and of the full story of Buffy the Vampire Slayer. Her story is epic. It is a story that even if all technology were to fail and we had no TV, no DVDs, no electronic reproduction, we would still tell the story of Buffy because her story is timeless, epic, human and universal. So for me, the fact they chose to tell more than show more this season is okay with me. They saved the best for last. Buffy has gone through all the classic stages of the hero's journey (as outlined by Joseph Campbell in "The Hero with a Thousand Faces") up to her reintegration into society with her knowledge of the infinite and its embedded foundation in mundane reality. Her journey is not complete until she shares this knowledge, but she must face the resentment and lack of understanding on the part of those around her who have not had the same life-altering experiences. Ultimately, by giving up the self, the knowledge of transcendence is passed on to others, on the field of battle, and this will finally allow her to pass seemlessly between worlds secure in the knowledge that the individualistic self matters not in the timeless all/nothing. What is the end, is the beginning and the beginning is the end. I am so looking forward to the last episode to see (and hear) the way all this will come to fruition. My allergies have been acting up for over a week now, just thinking what epic poetry Joss is going to give us to hold to ourselves to salve our souls. We can learn the truth of trancendence from Buffy, if we are willing to listen to what she has to say. Not just with our ears, but with our hearts.


Cindy - May 18, 2003 5:49:05 am PDT #552 of 10001
Nobody

OK - Now I'm hearing MY ANGELUS to the tune of MY SHIRONA.

Oh. You will pay. And pay. And pay for earworming me with that. Like it wasn't bad enough to be a child of the 70s in the first place. *shaky fist*


Anne W. - May 18, 2003 5:55:24 am PDT #553 of 10001
The lost sheep grow teeth, forsake their lambs, and lie with the lions.

Plei, I think you hit the nail on the head with:

...Is so wrapped up in trying to seem okay when she's not that she misses all sorts of little signals when other people are not okay.