I swear, one of these times, you're gonna wake up in a coma.

Cordelia ,'Showtime'


Buffy 4: Grr. Arrgh.  

This is where we talk about Buffy the Vampire Slayer! No spoilers though?if you post one by accident, an admin will delete it. This thread is NO LONGER NAFDA. Please don't discuss current Angel events here.


Gleebo - Aug 08, 2003 9:27:54 pm PDT #4420 of 10001
"God...my brilliance is now becoming a bit of a burden...get back to me." Dr. Cox - Scrubs

When did anyone else first begin to think that they could/should make Evil Willow happen? For me it was Becoming Pt 2 in the hospital scene. Then again with the infamous pencil stake of death, showing that she could use magic(although minimal at the time) to get her out of situations.


Sean K - Aug 08, 2003 9:31:09 pm PDT #4421 of 10001
You can't leave me to my own devices; my devices are Nap and Eat. -Zenkitty

I don't remember a precise moment when I picked up on it (started watching S3), but I think I always kind of got that vibe from her, or at least started picking up on it as a possibility fairly early on.

And from what I understand, once she dabbled with magic, Dark Willow was always going to be part of her future arc, it was just a matter of finding the right way to do it.


Gleebo - Aug 08, 2003 10:22:07 pm PDT #4422 of 10001
"God...my brilliance is now becoming a bit of a burden...get back to me." Dr. Cox - Scrubs

I agree that it was just a matter of finding the way to do it. Many will quibble that it wasn't the right way that they turned out doing to have it happen. But seriously what else were they gonna use to have Willow go evil that was a justifiable and believable reason? Someone stole her highlighter? The death of a loved one was the most powerful thing that could have fueled a chance in our lovable old Willow.

Although without we could have done without the magic addiction storyline that led up to this as well.


Noumenon - Aug 08, 2003 10:28:47 pm PDT #4423 of 10001
No other candidate is asking the hard questions, like "Did geophysicists assassinate Jim Henson?" or "Why is there hydrogen in America's water supply?" --defective yeti

Maybe if she had been addicted to sniffing her highlighter, and then someone stole it...


DCJensen - Aug 08, 2003 10:41:36 pm PDT #4424 of 10001
All is well that ends in pizza.

Maybe she deserves a toaster of her own:

Farewell, reluctant chosen chick


brenda m - Aug 09, 2003 8:47:39 am PDT #4425 of 10001
If you're going through hell/keep on going/don't slow down/keep your fear from showing/you might be gone/'fore the devil even knows you're there

Before Hush, would you have thought of Willow as closeted?

Closeted, no. But not-really-aware-yet, yes. I thought the chemistry between W and T in Hush was so very clear and directed that after that it wasn't so much a matter of "if" but "when." I think it's pretty plausible that it's an aspect of herself that had never really become apparent to her consciously, and that meeting a particular someone could bring it rushing to the surface.

Remember that for Willow, and all the scoobs, their social circle is pretty limited, both because of the secret nature of what they do and the time and focus it requires from them. Tara burst on the scene with her entry to that world already appparent - with the Gentlemen, she knew crazy shit was going on, and her witchcraft meant she didn't have to be lied to. What other women did Willow ever really get close to? Other than Jenny Calendar, who she did at least mildly crush on (though I see it as a "be her" rather than "want her" crush), there's only Buffy. So I can buy it as a part of her that she never really examined until Tara came along and it all came rushing to the surface.

He thought I was getting beat up by an abusive boyfriend.

My college career counselor grabbed my arm the first time I had an appt. with her and cried, "Who. Hit. YOU?" (I always had finger marks on my upper arms)

My sister fell and split her lip open the other day. My dad takes her to the ER for stitches. The doctor comes in, looks at my dad, and says "You the guy that did this?" all jokey-jokey. My dad recounted this story to me as a funny one. So very, very not.


Cindy - Aug 09, 2003 9:26:38 am PDT #4426 of 10001
Nobody

My college career counselor grabbed my arm the first time I had an appt. with her and cried, "Who. Hit. YOU?" (I always had finger marks on my upper arms)

A woman I worked with was one of the first Norplant patients around here. I saw the bruise and then she was out of work for a few days, and came back, not quite herself. I finally screwed up the courage to ask what happened to her arm.


Micole - Aug 09, 2003 10:21:53 am PDT #4427 of 10001
I've been working on a song about the difference between analogy and metaphor.

I thought the Willow/Tara chemistry was palpable--and adorable--in "Hush," and then unfortunately minimal up until "The Body" and then the shift to UPN. By which I mean that I got a sense of sexual tension from them in "Hush," of attraction and comfort in "The Body," and of attraction in the UPN run, but that the WB's clear discomfort with the actors touching each other on screen hurt the storyline a bit. As Cindy points out, we never see Willow and Tara's first kiss; as other people have pointed out before, we don't know for sure when they first slept together, something that cannot be said of any heterosexual couple who got together during the course of the series.

I did see the storyline as being clearly one of romance and attraction. And for me the moment when it definitively moved from subtext to text wasn't "New Moon Rising," but "Who Are You?" Not Faith's remark, but Tara's "I am, you know. Yours."


victor infante - Aug 09, 2003 12:09:45 pm PDT #4428 of 10001
To understand what happened at the diner, we shall use Mr. Papaya! This is upsetting because he's the friendliest of fruits.

What other women did Willow ever really get close to?

Amy, I suppose, but then she was a rat.


ted r - Aug 09, 2003 3:43:58 pm PDT #4429 of 10001
"You got twelve, and they got twelve. The old ladies are just as good as you are." -Dr. Einstein

Amy, I suppose, but then she was a rat.

As it turned out, yeah.

Reading that farewell in The Australian made me all sniffly again.