Sometimes I miss having powers... Oh. Oh! I know what this is! This is peer pressure! Any second now you're gonna make me smoke tobacco and--and have drugs!

Anya ,'Showtime'


Buffy 4: Grr. Arrgh.  

This is where we talk about Buffy the Vampire Slayer! No spoilers though?if you post one by accident, an admin will delete it. This thread is NO LONGER NAFDA. Please don't discuss current Angel events here.


Lady O' Spain - Jun 13, 2003 11:28:21 am PDT #2657 of 10001
Red hair and black leather--my favorite color scheme.

Also, in my version Willow is bisexual. Unless Joss personally tells me otherwise.

It is hard to tell when they are being serious, but Joss and Marti have much to say about this in the commentary for Wild at Heart on the S4 DVD.

Haven't seen the DVD yet, but the way I've always wanked it is that Willow is bi (she was definately in love with both Oz and Tara) but describes herself as gay. As in, the character is making the mistake, not the writers. We could probably get into all kinds of nifty psychobabble about why Willow does this (trying to distance herself further from geeky high-school Willow?) and why no one on the show has called her on it (ignorance, probably. Or they just don't care that much about sexual identity politics, what with the demons and all.)

Of course, I also subscribe to the "sexuality is a continuum" theory, especially since, even though I'm straight and married, there are a few females I wouldn't kick out of my bed. Uh, y'know, if I weren't married...


tina f. - Jun 13, 2003 11:29:53 am PDT #2658 of 10001

I have those, yet I don't remember that commentary.

I may have mixed it up a little with other commentary and the special feature season overview thingy - I did a marathon watch of all things commented upon the night I got them. But there was lots of talk about Willow not being gay, straight or bi - but falling in love with Oz and then falling in love with Tara. (They were still in S6 when the commentary was done - so no mention of the dreaded Kennedy) And that being that. And then of course, there is also a lot of talk about how Oz "made" Willow gay - which is them, obviously, kidding - so take it all for what you will.

I always felt like Willow was bisexual personally. But I always felt that way about pretty much all of them so...


Lyra Jane - Jun 13, 2003 11:32:10 am PDT #2659 of 10001
Up with the sun

I thought Kennedy was supposed to be East Coast old money. Which is unlikely, if you're Latina.

That was my impression, as well. From her name I'd sort of vaguely thought the actress was of Arabic descent, but I'd never thought the character had a specific ethnicity.

Maybe Kennedy is Italian, and her family's in the mob.


Lyra Jane - Jun 13, 2003 11:36:38 am PDT #2660 of 10001
Up with the sun

the way I've always wanked it is that Willow is bi (she was definately in love with both Oz and Tara) but describes herself as gay. As in, the character is making the mistake, not the writers.

This is what I think, too. And I think she may say she's gay for political reasons (she is, after all, her mothers daughter), or because Oz hurt her so badly.


Vortex - Jun 13, 2003 11:37:37 am PDT #2661 of 10001
"Cry havoc and let slip the boobs of war!" -- Miracleman

Haven't seen the DVD yet, but the way I've always wanked it is that Willow is bi (she was definately in love with both Oz and Tara) but describes herself as gay.

The only time I can remember Willow describing herself as gay is the infamous "Gay now!" quote. (I could be wrong about this, as we see that I'm sketchy today). And in that case, it was to challenge Anya, and would not have been nearly as effective if she'd said "Bi now!"


Katie M - Jun 13, 2003 11:38:13 am PDT #2662 of 10001
I was charmed (albeit somewhat perplexed) by the fannish sensibility of many of the music choices -- it's like the director was trying to vid Canada. --loligo on the Olympic Opening Ceremonies

Maybe Kennedy is Italian, and her family's in the mob.

Okay, see, this I like.


justkim - Jun 13, 2003 11:39:02 am PDT #2663 of 10001
Another social casualty...

I think that maybe Willow hasn't had enough relationships of either an intimate or a casual nature to really know for sure if she is lesbian or bi. I don't doubt for a minute that she loved Oz, and still does to some degree. I'm sure she loved Tara. And I'm sure she enjoys being with Kennedy.

I don't think we have seen enough of Willow really thinking about her sexuality to know for sure what she thinks other than that right now she identifies herself as lesbian. What happens to the character later is anyone's guess.


Jeff Mejia - Jun 13, 2003 11:43:43 am PDT #2664 of 10001
"Don't think of yourself as an organic pain collector racing towards oblivion." Dogbert to Dilbert

The only time I can remember Willow describing herself as gay is the infamous "Gay now!" quote. (I could be wrong about this, as we see that I'm sketchy today). And in that case, it was to challenge Anya, and would not have been nearly as effective if she'd said "Bi now!"

She also identified herself as gay to the CoW in "Checkpoint", and there was the "and I think I'm kinda gay" quote in "Tabula Rasa" (which was slagged on these boards as being a retread), so it's not just one instance that Willow identifies herself as gay.


Lady O' Spain - Jun 13, 2003 11:56:17 am PDT #2665 of 10001
Red hair and black leather--my favorite color scheme.

I think that maybe Willow hasn't had enough relationships of either an intimate or a casual nature to really know for sure if she is lesbian or bi. I don't doubt for a minute that she loved Oz, and still does to some degree. I'm sure she loved Tara. And I'm sure she enjoys being with Kennedy.

I don't think we have seen enough of Willow really thinking about her sexuality to know for sure what she thinks other than that right now she identifies herself as lesbian. What happens to the character later is anyone's guess.

ITA. Also, Willow strikes me as the type who will fixate on the present situation at the expense of the big picture--in other words, she's completely into who she is RIGHT NOW and would find the past insignificant. So she's thinking, "Hey, I've got a girlfriend, I'm doing the witchcraft, that's who I am! I am 100% lesbian wicca girl!" and not allowing her "old identity" (geeky, awkward, cute, Oz-dating, techno-whiz Willow) to factor into her current self-image.


Cindy - Jun 13, 2003 12:03:46 pm PDT #2666 of 10001
Nobody

I'm 99% sure that all of Willow's 'gay now' type statements came after her argument with Tara in Tough Love, and I always chalked up her identification as gay (with the 'only' implied) to growing out of that fight. That was the argument with the 'lesbo street cred' crack by Willow, when she was afraid Tara was insinuating she was LUG.

I may have mixed it up a little with other commentary and the special feature season overview thingy - I did a marathon watch of all things commented upon the night I got them. But there was lots of talk about Willow not being gay, straight or bi - but falling in love with Oz and then falling in love with Tara. (They were still in S6 when the commentary was done - so no mention of the dreaded Kennedy) And that being that. And then of course, there is also a lot of talk about how Oz "made" Willow gay - which is them, obviously, kidding - so take it all for what you will.

I always felt like Willow was bisexual personally. But I always felt that way about pretty much all of them so...

I only have a memory of this, not a citation, but sometime after season 6, Joss gave an interview in which he pretty flat out stated that he'd often played around with the idea of matching Willow with another guy, after Tara. However, given how Tara died, and the outcry from some parts of the fandom, he and Marti decided it would be wrong of them to involve her with anyone who wasn't a woman.

I think that's too bad. But really, I wish nobody had been involved this season. I understand it probably was an important part of Willow's healing process, but I think Kennedy and all the SiTs took away too much screen time from important elements of the story. I don't hate Kennedy. I resented that she was so front and center.