Spike: At least give me Wesley's office since he's gone. Angel: He's not gone. He's on a leave of absence. Spike: Yeah, right. Boo-hoo. Thought he killed his bloody father. Try staking your mother when she's coming on to you! Harmony: Well…that explains a lot.

'Destiny'


Buffy 4: Grr. Arrgh.  

This is where we talk about Buffy the Vampire Slayer! No spoilers though?if you post one by accident, an admin will delete it. This thread is NO LONGER NAFDA. Please don't discuss current Angel events here.


KristenB - May 21, 2003 7:03:52 am PDT #1478 of 10001

It was sad to see Anya go - see them all go, but all and all it was a really good ending. It was wonderful to see the four discussing plans after the battle, that one took me back a bit! I suddenly remembered the count down on the WB to the beginning and here I was at the end. What a great show this was and forever will be. Ok...my ranting is done!


Anne W. - May 21, 2003 7:12:04 am PDT #1479 of 10001
The lost sheep grow teeth, forsake their lambs, and lie with the lions.

Fanwankery re. Pod!Giles this season:

Giles didn't seem un-Gilesy until he got to the States with the Potentials in tow. He seemed Gilesish even in that last scene with Robson (right before the squeaky shoes). IMO, he started acting like Giles again when Buffy presented him with her power-sharing plan.

Giles' reaction to the plan was that it was completely contrary to anything that had ever been done or attempted before--by the Watchers, that is. I think that was the first time he truly realized that the power to save the world was in the hands of the Slayer, and not in the hands of the Slayer-as-backed-by-the-Watchers. Even though Giles had a love/hate relationship with the Council, I do think that he saw them, and not the Slayer, as humanity's last line of defense.

I think that he arrived in Sunnydale expecting to lose (even if he didn't realize this consciously). When Buffy outlined her plan, I think he realized that they could win, and that he didn't have to be the Watcher any more than Buffy had to be the Slayer.


Wenda - May 21, 2003 7:18:55 am PDT #1480 of 10001
"I'm a mouse with a piece of string, Bear. The possibilities are endless." - Tutter

Grossly overused the implied first-person in this paragraph.

Hee! This is why I like this board.


Anne W. - May 21, 2003 7:24:07 am PDT #1481 of 10001
The lost sheep grow teeth, forsake their lambs, and lie with the lions.

Cereal:

The idea of aloneness/not-aloneness has been brought up throughout this season.

Even as a demon, Anya was somewhat on the outs with the demon community. In Selfless, her best friend was killed in place of her, and she ended that episode not being sure of who she was or where she would go from there, only that things would change. This compares nicely to Buffy's cookie speech and Spike pulling a Sidney Carton on her behalf.

CwDP shows the core characters (minus Xander) at their most alone. Buffy is reminded of her inferiority/superiority complex. Dawn is left alone/taunted with the notion of Buffy abandoning her. Willow is forcefully reminded of Tara's absence (I know that AB wasn't there for contractual or other reasons, but when you take away the meta, not being able to see Tara was just one more reminder that she was no longer there). When kept apart from the others by the First, Spike becomes a killer again. The last word of that wonderfully creepy song was "alone," just hanging there over the closing credits.

Faith notices that even when surrounded by Scoobies, Buffy's life was terribly lonely.

There's more to say on the subject, but I really need to get some work done today. Do these ideas seem to have any merit?


candyb - May 21, 2003 7:24:12 am PDT #1482 of 10001

Even though Giles had a love/hate relationship with the Council, I do think that he saw them, and not the Slayer, as humanity's last line of defense.

Maybe in S1, but this is not the Giles I thought I was seeing in S2-5. After S2, I always thought Giles was grudgingly to proudly on board with Buffy's unconventional way of doing things.

I just can't buy any Gileswank. To me, Giles was written as a jerk to push Buffy to Spike.

So while Chosen can't make sense of everthing that confused and angered me about the second half of S7, it did set right the things I most care about in a very satisfying manner.


§ ita § - May 21, 2003 7:25:29 am PDT #1483 of 10001
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.

KristenB!

I, too, was one of the ones that started with it, and finished with it, and it's a good feeling to have done that with a show that wasn't cancelled unrisen.

I always wanted it done in season seven. I just didn't want it over ...


mikal - May 21, 2003 7:29:52 am PDT #1484 of 10001
What I love most about you core whores: the foreplay .... tina F.

Do these ideas seem to have any merit?

It's lonely at the top? It's what Buffy's been struggling with since her resurrection. I thought it was all spelled out during the musical (all those minor keys). The whole of vampdom to me is lonliness (an expansion of the catholic purgatory where one mourns the loss of the face of God ... or hell ... where one knows one will nver see the face of God again). with Vampdom .... one may never love again throughout the eternity of their existence. Evil depends on lovelessness - yes?


Kat - May 21, 2003 7:31:49 am PDT #1485 of 10001
"I keep to a strict diet of ill-advised enthusiasm and heartfelt regret." Leigh Bardugo

I got a favor to ask, could someone please nilly links to the posts (or even the articles themselves) that got posted. I was all spoilery resistant but I'd love to be able to find them and go back and read them.


Micole - May 21, 2003 7:36:17 am PDT #1486 of 10001
I've been working on a song about the difference between analogy and metaphor.

Ifn you deleted because you weren't saying what you meant to say, Micole, then c'est la vie. But I hope you weren't feeling attacked or under pressure to defend yourself, because of my responses.

Hi, Julie. Thanks for checking in. I didn't feel attacked, and I appreciate your thoughtful responses to my posts. I didn't actually delete my main post; I deleted a complaint about having been inadvertantly spoiled for some key elements of the finale, which was irrelevant and, um, really bitchy. Because that was more about me being in a lousy mood than about making a contribution to the conversation.

I shall have to meara a response to a lot of the great things people have been saying later this week, because today's going to be really hectic for me. Nothing to do with feeling chased out of the conversation. I don't feel like that at all.


Laura - May 21, 2003 7:54:59 am PDT #1487 of 10001
Our wings are not tired.

I'm so glad I wasn't spoiled and had no clue about Spike. There has been much discussion of the Buffy/Spike connection from the beginning. Now they are both free.

I am so content and satisfied. Thank you Joss.