What if a the thread were continued for one last stand, 10,000 posts guaranteed, and at the end of that thread, the topic would be closed permanantly.

Um, I'm pretty sure that *is* the proposal. In other words, the proposal is to simply close the thread once it reaches 10000, not create a new thread. As you can see from the discussion generated here, those who want to keep the thread open do not consider that a compromise.

Is this a good time to close the Firefly thread? Possibly. I can see the arguments for both sides. But my own preference would be to see Firefly 5 created and then a vote to close the thread. Merely reaching the 10,000 post limit is not enough for me to vote to close the thread.

I think this too is meant as a compromise, along the lines of "if we don't close the thread now we can always bring up the possibility of closing it later." Frankly, "bring up another vote to close it later" doesn't sound like any more of a compromise than "vote to close it now."

Original proposal:

I propose that we close the dedicated Firefly thread and continue our discussions in the Minearverse thread.

Which seems to be 2 in one. First, to close it now, not at the magic 10,000 count point. and Second, to adjust the Minearverse thread to be the place to talk Firefly stuff. Obviously that can be reworded when the ballot is written.

Seems attention in the beginning was a NIMBY effect of "we don't want them drunken Browncoats in our lounge", and more recently of "should we end the Firefly". As of yet, it seems neither has been decided, but I guess that is what the voting is for. It will be curious to see how the ballot is written.

:: pulls up chair, pops the can o beer and watches intently ::

Second, to adjust the Minearverse thread to be the place to talk Firefly stuff.

That's been revised. The current proposal is to let discussion happen where it will.

If a spirited discussion begins I would think it would have to be with the understanding that the thread would be closed after X consition is reached, be it a time limit or post number limit. Add it to the header if necessary. If the users choose to use that condition to discuss episodes, the exact proper length of a real browncoat, and/or a new on-line place to meet after the thread is closed, it's up to them. At least they would know their time is limited when they started.

It seems to me to be very similar to what happened when Table Talk went to paid subscription. A time limit was given; the Buffistas used some of that time to come up with contingency plans. The existence of this board is the result of that time limit to plan. I don't see why we can't extend a time limit to other users. I'm sure if there were a need/reason to close Sang Sacre, for example, the users would be given a chance to plan to regroup elsewhere, assuming they haven't already.

I'm sure someone will make an argument that the users should have made contingency plans before, and the argument has already been made that there are already places to go on the 'net to discuss FF. Regardless, contigency plans apparently weren't made, and people have discussed their discomfort at other FF sites. I don't see who it harms to allow a little more time. Six months or 5,000 posts; whatever. Aimee could pick something, and, if it passes, it sticks. What the users choose to do with that grace period is their business.

Um, I'm pretty sure that *is* the proposal.

My understanding is that the topic (as opposed to thread) will be closed in the very near future, either immediately upon approval of the vote or when the current thread reaches 10,000 (less than 100 posts to go now). I'm unclear as to which of those two options is really being proposed.

My compromise suggestion is to allow the topic to continue for one more thread, for a limited amount of time/posts.

Thanks Dana, forgot about that :)

Using Buffy/Angel as an example is not really a good idea. Buffy/Angel is closer to our sort of charter, the preamble to our constitution. It's self-evident.

Minearverse would be a better example to use, I think.

I had a similar reaction that I am still struggling to verbalize. It feels like, at various points in this discussion, a distinction is being drawn between the Firefly thread denizens and Buffistas. I know the sets are by no means identical but the us-and-them-ness bothers me. Even though I'm not completely sure it isn't all in my head.

Using Buffy/Angel as an example is not really a good idea. Buffy/Angel is closer to our sort of charter, the preamble to our constitution. It's self-evident.

I'm having a really difficult time understanding why the Firefly concept should not have the same status here as Buffy/Angel and why it keeps getting referred to as an under-used show thread rather than a culture that should be considered part of Buffistas.org. Why Firefly keeps getting compared to other show threads like Smallville, or sub-communities like Minearverse, or hypothetical threads that will eventually need to be closed, but not to Buffy/Angel - well, I just don't get it.

So I went back through the archives to see how Firefly had been treated in the beginning. Obviously, there was a lot of excitement because it was the first Joss Whedon show to premiere after Buffy/Angel. The board opened up a Firefly thread. (I believe there was some discussion in TT about Firefly, but by the time Phoenix arose there was none.) Two weeks later a Quotables Firefly thread was opened as well. It had become accepted that Firefly had the same status as Buffy/Angel. No other show has had a Quotables thread.

Joss Whedon posted about the Firefly cancellation here. It is not irrelevant that a significant wave joined up following the (in)famous joss posting. This means that a) joss saw this board as a significant Firefly board; b) the media saw this board as a significant Firefly board; and c) many of the people who joined following the posting saw this board as a significant Firefly board. Whatever the Phoenix board was originally intended to be, Firefly was now inextricably linked with it.

Of further signficance was the changing of the slug, which still reads, ""A community dedicated to discussions of Buffy the Vampire Slayer, Angel and Firefly with humor, intelligence and obsessiveness." Certainly a person coming to the board could make the reasonable assumption that Firefly is an integral part of Buffistas.org. I know I did.

Further, the community put Firefly quotes in the Buffistas.org quote generator. Once again, not a single person made a single objection to including Firefly quotes - and at that time nobody was shy about expressing any discomfort in Beauracracy.

Look at the FAQ. Still starts off with, " Warning: This FAQ may contain spoilers up to and including the full run of Buffy, Firefly the Series and Angel 4.22." and later on, " Q. Where can I get Buffy, Angel and Firefly on DVD?" Followed by Amazon links to Buffy, Angel and Firefly.

Firefly quotes were even discussed for deathmatching - again something only done with Buffy and Angel. But at the time the movie was coming out so it was felt that waiting was a better option.

You say Buffy/Angel are part of the original charter? Then Firefly has been amended into the bylaws.

I guess I see a lot of it's-just-another-dead-show-threadness going round in this discussion, and I just can't understand it. For me, and others who have posted quite emotionally here, the Firefly thread is not just a show thread. It's part of why we became buffistas.

I realize the above was a mouthful, so I want to say also that if the board closes the thread that's okay by me. It's not going to change my feelings for anyone here. It's not going to change my life, and I, as I'm sure all of you, have much more pressing things going on. Like every other issue I've argued for or against in B-crazy or Lightbulbs, this too shall pass. I don't mean this as condescending. I just mean to say that I've grown up some and no longer feel like it's my way or it's the wrong way. I bow to the will of the voters.