I'm considering withdrawing the proposal, because I don't think I considered the issues before proposing it (hello, impulse control issues), but I'd like the conversation to continue a little longer first.

Personally, I think it might be healthier for the board if you let it go to a vote, Amy. It's not like this is the first time it's come up. When it has come up before, there's always been this big jumble of uncomfortable feelings. If you let it go to a vote, we have to shut our mouths and live with the decision for six months, no matter what. That's seldom a bad thing for us, in my opinion.

My opinion? If Amy feels she wants to withdraw the proposal, she should. It was her proposal.

Anyone else is welcome to propose it after that. Yes, we have this discussion. And it feels like a lot, even.

But I don't want to pressure someone into forcing a vote just because we can. If Amy doesn't want the idea of her proposal to go through, she shouldn't be the one sending it to a vote.

Someone who either wants the thread so they could use it or - what it honestly feels like to me - to get us out of their thread can take it up as soon as this is done.

2 posts 6467 - 6468: Fire Serpent

1 post 6470: Fire Serpent

subtotal: 3

Guess I shouldn't propose that Fire Serpent thread.

My opinion? If Amy feels she wants to withdraw the proposal, she should. It was her proposal.

Anyone else is welcome to propose it after that. Yes, we have this discussion. And it feels like a lot, even.

But I don't want to pressure someone into forcing a vote just because we can. If Amy doesn't want the idea of her proposal to go through, she shouldn't be the one sending it to a vote.

I agree with this.

I have utterly no dog in this hunt, but I find this interesting:

scanning through Boxed Set threads give me no reason to think SPN couldn't support it's own thread.

Isn't [enthusiasm + posting volume] what led to Heroes having its own thread? Also, Smallville?

EATA: I know there are posters (Hi, Drew!) who want separate threads for each show, so they can discuss what they've been able to watch, and not be spoiled or subjected to discussion on shows they haven't watched or won't watch. I can understand that impulse. But realistically, you're looking at eight posts per week in each of those threads,

But what about shows like SPN (and Heroes, and Smallville) that have more than 8 posts per week?

As I said, I have no preference, but I'm reading this discussion with interest, because it's making me wonder how we ever did -- in the past -- decide that a single show was deserving of its own thread.

Also, now I'm enormously curious about Fire Serpent, b/c I'd never heard of it before.

Amy, I hope you know I wasn't trying to pressure you into anything. I hope I didn't make you feel that way. I am sorry if I did. I was just stating my opinion. I was hoping my "I think," made that clear, but it seems that it didn't. I'm not sure where I went wrong there.

I don't really care where the show ends up -- I see the benefits to doing it both ways. I feel badly for the non-cable having SPN watchers, who won't go in Boxed Set. I feel badly for those among the non-SPN watching Boxed-Setters who feel squeezed. I feel badly for those among the SPN watching Boxed Setters who feel pushed out.

The only thing I really don't get is why people think SPN can't sustain a thread on its own. I understand that they feel that way, but the numbers (to me) seem to indicate otherwise, so I don't understand why. Granted, I provided a very limited sample, because I was doing everything with eye and hand. I do understand the other why-nots, particularly the cross-pollination aspect, as described by Beverly (I think).

But what about shows like SPN (and Heroes, and Smallville) that have more than 8 posts per week?

Thanks Tep, this is what I don't get. SPN isn't an 8ppw show. Let me make clear that last post of stats only uses one week's worth of posts. In other words, there were 132 SPN posts in one week (with no DVD W&P, by the way).

Isn't [enthusiasm + posting volume] what led to Heroes having its own thread? Also, Smallville?

I don't think you can bring Smallville into this, because any thread that was grandfathered in from WX was subject to a different set of concerns. We just created threads willy-nilly then.

EATA: I know there are posters (Hi, Drew!) who want separate threads for each show, so they can discuss what they've been able to watch, and not be spoiled or subjected to discussion on shows they haven't watched or won't watch. I can understand that impulse. But realistically, you're looking at eight posts per week in each of those threads, with the same four or five people posting, and never talking to anybody in any of the other threads. That's not a posting board, or a fannish community. I don't feel that experience is what b.org is or ever has been. Maybe that's where we're going, ultimately. But it doesn't sound like a lot of fun, to me.

Yes.

Every single show with its own thread and waiting for the participation between people who are watching live, those that are timeshifting and then for those waiting for the dvds and time to get through them is not the type of board that *I* want to participate in, necessarily.

Maybe that's why no one's ever proposed such a thing?

Maybe that's why no one's ever proposed such a thing?

I think it's arguable that it's being proposed one thread at a time.

I don't really feel like this is my fight to post in. But, IMO, the only single-show threads that have been successful for more than one season are threads for Jossverse shows. I don't think there's really a critical mass for other shows. But that's just, again, my impression.

Well, one of the things that I think we were looking for in the experimental tv threads was an idea of whether some of those shows might support their own threads, in addition to testing out the idea of bucket threads. I don't see any call for dedicated threads for any of those shows, and I don't really expect too, not with the current crop of shows anyway.

I do think SPN, given the intensity of feeling, the combination of both serious discussion and squeeage, and the fact that it's not just posting tied to new eps running, is closer to a Jossverse show in people's relationship to it than any we've seen in recent years.

It's upsetting that SPN posters are feeling squeezed, but it sounds to me like some other people are as well. I don't know what the answer is here, but I don't think dismissing those people's concerns as shutting down SPNers for "having the nerve to talk about it" or suggesting that it's just some new thread free-for-all is helpful.

I don't know what the answer is here, but I don't think dismissing those people's concerns as shutting down SPNers for "having the nerve to talk about it" or suggesting that it's just some new thread free-for-all is helpful.

I don't think hyperbole is helpful, either. However-- each time a thread is proposed someone mentions what we've done under similar circumstances, whether to be fair to each proposed thread or to ensure we are acting consistently. In this discussion people have mentioned what we did with LotR, Heroes, and Smallville, IIRC. It seems natural therefore to consider what precedent would be set by creating this thread. So if by starting this thread we are setting a precedent that allows for a thread free-for-all, that seems a valid concern to me.