I actually think that it's that Heroes is a broader ensemble, where it's story/plot-driven rather than character driven. If that makes sense.

Yeap, this. The lack of central pairing is another aspect of it. But then, Firefly was an ensemble without one main pairing that took the fandom by storm, and I'd totally call it a mediafannish show (despite the fact that I know almost as many male fans of the show as I do the females.) FF was more character than plot-driven show though.

I'm 1700 posts behind in Box Set because I'm trying to avoid the Heroes and SPN talk. I'm woefully behind on the first and I'm waiting for hiatus on the second. Otherwise, I'm up to date with BSG and DF and I'd love to discuss them on Sundays, but I am utterly incapable of skipping over what I don't want to read at the time. So I haven't ventured into BS since the beginning of January, and that makes me sad. By the time I catch up, there will be no point in responding.

Again, I have to point and nod at this statement. The thing is, I can be mediafannish about a number of shows, but if I can't go into a thread without being spolied for a show I really want to get into later, then it becomes an all or nothing situation. I would really like to share the squee and flail, but I can't unless I'm able to keep current with every single show--which just isn't tenable for me.

Vonnie, do you think The Office is media fannish, or does it fail to be, because there's no world building at all?

I would've said I had no opinion on whether Heroes should have its own thread, but reading this discussion is (a) helping me to form an opinion (b) is one of the more interesting discussions we've had in a while and (c) is (I think) a really useful articulation of Where Do We Go From Here as a community.

b.org definitely has one foot in mediafandom, and has two or three other feet in places which are not. (We have a lot of feet.)

I concur with Laura that VM and Lost threads should be allowed to dwindle down rather than trade them out for a Heroes thread. There's always been a tradition of respecting the communities that form within a thread, and that's something we should keep in mind if we do form a Heroes thread. We don't generally close threads out when they still have activity. (LoTR was a very active thread while the movies were coming out, but didn't have a ton of steam after it was all done. It made sense to close that.)

Even forming Boxed Set out of Smallville, Farscape and Due South was a little traumatic.

But I do think the Premium Channel thread has served its purpose. Both as a place to discuss those shows, and also to cross-pollinate. You walk in a Deadwood fan, and you walk out with a Wire box set.

So, just thinking about the way VM and Lost have died down and that some clumping of shows is probably valuable to maintain thread vitality, I probably lean towards finding some useful bucket threads rather than single thread shows.

I'm not sure what buckets to use though.

Just so long as you don't take away my bucket, please.

You walk in a Deadwood fan, and you walk out with a Wire box set.

And those premium cocksuckers are premium-pricey, damn it!

I'm not sure what buckets to use though.

Yeah, this is still the problem. We can't go on with the one big lump, because it's clear that people are really having problems with the volume, and ultimately giving up on discussing the stuff that they want to discuss. And (I think I'm repeating myself here) I really don't like single-show threads. Cross-pollenation GOOD.

Honestly, I'm not super-attached to a broadcast-cable split, but it seemed like one way to poke at some of those problems without spawning a squillion threads. If that is the way people want to go, they still shouldn't be general TV threads -- but honestly, I don't think there's that much danger of that. As Burrell noted back at the utterly non-guacamole-laden start of it all, she felt like Heroes was the kind of thing that Buffistas were obviously going to be discussing somewhere. Those are the shows that end up in son-of-boxed-set pretty much on their own, and worrying about is-this-genre or is-this-mediafannish, or whose definitions of those things are we even using, have been small flares in a long history of "Hey, shiny new Dresden Files series! It's off to BS we go!"

Vonnie, do you think The Office is media fannish, or does it fail to be, because there's no world building at all?

Hmmm, sort of? I didn't see a big cross-pollination with the traditional slash community, which is understandable (I mean, Michael/Ryan is practical canon, but not the... erm, kind of ship that'd generate a loyal following and spew, like, a George Foreman Grill fetish, etc.), but there is a big representation in TO fandom by Veronica Mars fans, not to mention old X-Files fans coming out of woodwork. It's not too surprising since there is a big central pairing that's powered by UST and emotional engagement/squee aspect a-plenty -- it just draws the het part of the fandom (or the omni-preferential ones *waves to Dana*) rather than the slash contingent.

One of the reasons Premium worked was because there was crossover interest between shows and because there was a clear line between cable haves and have nots. It had both elements that we're considering.

(Those elements being: (1) split by cable access; (2) group by common interest - fannish or sci-fi or prevalence of leather pants.)

How about this - we list all the shows that are getting discussion (that don't currently have their own thread) and see if there are some obvious ways to group them?

Heroes
Supernatural
Battlestar Galactica
Smallville
The Dresden Files
The Office

What else? Friday Night Lights? House?

If you make a cable/broadcast split, people are still going to have issues. If I am watching SPN on DVD and Heroes on TV, I'm still fucked.

I like Boxed Set. It's the closest thing I can imagine to a general TV thread that even slightly works. The cross-pollination is a thing of beauty, and I adore it. I have at times stayed out of the thread because I was behind, or read with one eye closed because I really wanted to get to discussion of one show without having caught up on another.

I'm okay with that. Truth is, unless I'm fired up about a show, a dedicated thread is just so much more reading for me. So I tend to skip it, or read it once every few days. But if it's right there in front of me, I get engaged more, exposed to other ideas and viewpoints, and usually end up liking the show more.