The problem is that it's hard to determine what, in fact, is common knowledge and what is not.

Right now, it's you and Trudy who are determining what the rest of the people can and cannot say, because as outlined by the "SMG will not return" news, you've said that's okay. "Nick Brendon will not be on Angel" is not okay. This is puzzling. This is why I think it's important to hammer it out.

well, yes, somewhere out there someone says lots and lots of things.

Either talk about casting on the thread and make people (who've been here from the beginning) decide whether they need to leave the community in order to enjoy the show or don't.

Cindy, in this post you spell out the Google terms I used to verify a casting spoiler. Since I stated I was looking up a spoiler, it's kinda telltale. Can you white them back out again?

"SMG will not return" news, you've said that's okay. "Nick Brendon will not be on Angel" is not okay

This was settled a LONG time ago.

The first meant that there would be no show. The second meant that people who had been spoiled that someone from buffy was moving to angel now had one less canditate and were thereby more spoiled.

Nick wasn't a problem in and of it's self, it was an exascerbation of the elephant.

It seems to me that this discussion has devolved into an argument, rather than a way for all parties to work hard to reach a workable consensus. Spoiler Ho's and spoiler phobes are never going to agree. Ever. And, really, why should they? The way people experience an art form is so visceral and so personal that it may never be understandable by those with a different preference. The point here is not to convince or condemn but to make the board work for everybody. There has to be a way to do that, I think.

And let me just add this, although I respect everyone's opinions, do I feel sorry for any of you? No, because none of you have suffered as I have suffered. I like to be someowhat spoiled and live with a big spoilerphobe and so had to sit at a dinner table many times WITH A BUFFY WRITER and not talk about what was going to happen. Oh, the pain! And the BF suffered, too, as Jane let slip stuff without meaning to sometimes and then he was stuck knowing what he didn't want to.

Do you feel sorry for me now? No? Oh, well.

Right now, it's you and Trudy who are determining what the rest of the people can and cannot say, because as outlined by the "SMG will not return" news, you've said that's okay. "Nick Brendon will not be on Angel" is not okay. This is puzzling. This is why I think it's important to hammer it out.

You know, saying that Leonard Nimoy will not be on AtS is not a spoiler. Saying that he will be is. Saying that AA will be returning is not a spoiler (because, IMO, status quo is the expected); saying that AA will not be returning is. Saying NB will not be on AtS is not a spoiler - unlesss (and I believe this was the case in the oft mentioned kerfluffle) it has first been mentioned that someone from BtVS will be on AtS.

Maybe it's a fine distinction, but the difference, to me, is that the assumption that the regular cast will be returning is pretty typical. Learning who is added or leaving changes the way people think of the upcoming season. For some people that increases the pleasure, for others, not so much.

(edit) You know what? I am kind of expecting that my definition of casting spoiler is the norm - What? You don't know how a COX-II inhibitor differs from an NSAID? How bizarre! - and I'm certainly not expecting people to wrap me in cotton wool. I will not winge about things, I will simply not be able to actively participate in any threads that have a looser spoiler policy than the one currently stated in our FAC.

I am, however, going to propose an end to this anti-spoiler law once this current topic has been dealt with.

I don't think this is really a problem, and I'm happy to agree to dispose of it. The most recent time it came up it wasn't the post that brought up an ME actor's new series that was the problem - it was that, in the days leading up to that, spoiled people (and I was one of them, and may very well have contributed) were careless about leaving references to the BCS in non-spoiled threads. If that information hadn't already been floated, the question of NB (or any Buffy alum) having a series would never have been an issue. It's unfortunate that it played out this way, because it caused some bad feeling and IMO distracts from the really substantive issues that have arisen since.

Also, note that I said "most recent." I've been looking through old threads for some guidance - I can't get into WX but I've looked as some of the old TT stuff. This "anti-spoiler" issue has indeed risen before, though never to such a degree. A post about Manchild was directed to spoilers, until it was spelled out that in British series it wouldn't necessarily affect ASH's presence on Buffy. Angel getting his own show, and later the network change, both came up in terms of what they told you about the future of B/A. Most relevantly, mention of the proposed Ripper series in the weeks leading up to The Gift was sternly chided because it ruled Giles out of the characters likely to die in that ep. Some of that went on during the season, which might or might not make them less relevant.

None of this is meant as a defense of an anti-spoiler rule, by any means. I think we'll do just fine without that. Just a little perspective, maybe.

Since you've been looking stuff up, brenda, can you answer my musical question?

Trudy, a quite a few of the "Spoiled" have left the thread so they can enjoy the show.

I used to be a spoilerphobe, but the more I wedged myself into more involved fandom, well, I can't avoid them.

Me: "What time is it?" Random writer, assistant, other fan: "It's half past the return of Doyle."

I gave up.

I understand your desire to be unspoiled, Trudy, but you don't seem to get that just as you would leave the thread to avoid the castings, others have left the thread in order to have discussions. That doesn't seem to affect you in the same way your leaving does affect me. Have you not thought about it, or does it not matter as much? Sure, I can go to Spoilers to discuss casting, but I'm also going to suffer sides, which is stuff I don't want to know. Weighed risks. Go Spoilers. Chose Spoilers.

Varying degrees. Right now, the far right wing of unspoiled rules the thread.

Also, do commericals on the network count? This is just promos that appear on the show the night it airs, correct?

Also, do commericals on the network count? This is just promos that appear on the show the night it airs, correct?

It is my understanding that commercials that air count.