I went back and reread the posts about this issue here, to get more of an "all at once" sense of things. And I'm left feeling angry: angry that several of us were directly hurt by SP's actions, angry that many of us were driven away from the board both by his actions and the fall out, and angry that 10 years of bad-faith community participation on his part have left so many of us second-guessing our own perceptions and decision making.
Spike: Taking up smoking, are you? Harmony: I am a villain, Spike. Hello!
Spike/Harm ,'Help'
Voting Discussion: We're Screwing In Light Bulbs AIFG!
We open it up, we talks the talk, we votes, we shuts it down. This thread is to free up Bureaucracy for daily details as we hammer out the Big Issues towards a vote. Open only when a proposal has been made and seconded according to Buffista policy (Which we voted on!). If this thread is closed, hie thee to Bureaucracy instead!
Calli - Oct 17, 2016 9:13:56 am PDT #10034 of 10289
I must obey the inscrutable exhortations of my soul—Calvin and Hobbs
Amy - Oct 17, 2016 9:19:16 am PDT #10035 of 10289
Because books.
The internalized misogyny question is really going to haunt me. I thought for a long time that Sunil was manipulative in the social- and professional-climbing sense, but the reason I never spoke up about his behavior was because I was convinced I was just being a bitch to assume that he would use people that way.
SailAweigh - Oct 17, 2016 9:21:19 am PDT #10036 of 10289
Nana korobi, ya oki. (Fall down seven times, stand up eight.) ~Yuzuru Hanyu/Japanese proverb
We were talking about grooming, yesterday, and I found a great thread on Twitter by one of the people involved explaining what it is: [link] and how it related to Sunil. It's spot on from what I used to see on Facebook all the time, but didn't realize what I was seeing.
NoiseDesign - Oct 17, 2016 9:24:18 am PDT #10037 of 10289
Our wings are not tired
I have nothing new to add. You can count on me for a vote in favor of his removal.
Volans - Oct 17, 2016 9:30:14 am PDT #10038 of 10289
move out and draw fire
Are we starting the vote on the 18th? I'm seeing a couple folks stating votes now, which will make it hard to count.
Trudy, you said exactly what I've been thinking.
Dana - Oct 17, 2016 9:32:21 am PDT #10039 of 10289
"I'm useless alone." // "We're all useless alone. It's a good thing you're not alone."
Voting will start Wednesday the 19th.
askye - Oct 17, 2016 9:32:57 am PDT #10040 of 10289
Thrive to spite them
The voting will happen separate and an email will get sent to whoever is counting the votes. So it doesn't matter about counting what is said here.
msbelle - Oct 17, 2016 9:35:34 am PDT #10041 of 10289
I remember the crazy days. 500 posts an hour. Nubmer! Natgbsb
I can count, but I do not know how to set up a poll.
Barb - Oct 17, 2016 10:11:29 am PDT #10042 of 10289
“Not dead yet!”
the reason I never spoke up about his behavior was because I was convinced I was just being a bitch to assume that he would use people that way.
Obviously, I saw the same, Amy, but I didn't say anything either and not because I was being a bitch but more because I figured someone with more clout (in the SFF world, where I'm still a newb) would see it and smack him down. I kept waiting and it didn't happen and in retrospect I think it's because of his habit of a) moving up and b) because he surrounded himself with and courted favor primarily from women. Very rarely did he seek out the approval or company of men. I wonder if it's because subconsciously, he must have known men wouldn't have put up with his shit.
Which makes me all the angrier I didn't say anything. Then again, I was busy trying to navigate my own path in this world.
Crap--there's just no right answer, is there?
Amy - Oct 17, 2016 10:21:50 am PDT #10043 of 10289
Because books.
The problem is, humans are human. There's always a gray area, unless you see someone actually drowning a kitten or something.
It does speak to how different online interaction can be from F2F, though, I think. Which doesn't make it better or worse, just different, and prone to some behavior that predators couldn't necessarily get away with in person.
In this case, especially, the online interaction made it a whole lot easier for him to reach a much greater number of women, most of whom he wouldn't have been able to interact with any other way.
Bah.