This money, it is too much. You should have some small refund.

Niska ,'War Stories'


Natter 74: Ready or Not  

Off-topic discussion. Wanna talk about corsets, duct tape, butt kicking, or physics? This is the place. Detailed discussion of any current-season TV must be whitefonted.


Jesse - Aug 12, 2016 6:39:00 am PDT #25942 of 30003
Sometimes I trip on how happy we could be.

Gud, I don't know you very well, but if even half of the stuff you say here is true, the problem in this relationship is not you.

That one.

The best analogy I can come up with is that -- this is my experience only; obviously I can't speak for any other person in any kind of a relationship -- marriage involves work for sure, but it's *satisfying* work, like putting a lot of work into a hobby you love. (I'm thinking of how much work it is to make cosplay costumes, or to have a garden that produces a good bounty, or mastering a piece of music, or or or.) No question that it's work. And it could be described as "hard," but not in the march-through-Death-Valley sense. It's satisfying work, and work worth doing.

Ah, that's such a good analogy. I feel like I've only ever heard "Ugh, it's such hard work" or "It not work, it's a joy!"


Jesse - Aug 12, 2016 6:40:48 am PDT #25943 of 30003
Sometimes I trip on how happy we could be.

Hey, so remember when I was so mad about my medical bills? It's open enrollment, and I totally signed up for the same plan again because I remembered why I did it in the first place -- it's $50/month cheaper than the next-most-expensive plan. So even paying however much it was out of pocket this year, I'm overall ahead of the game cost-wise, even still.

Fingers crossed!


Gudanov - Aug 12, 2016 7:19:13 am PDT #25944 of 30003
Coding and Sleeping

Fingers crossed!

The motto of the U.S. health care system.


Maria - Aug 12, 2016 7:33:12 am PDT #25945 of 30003
Not so nice is that I'm about to ruin a Friday morning for a bunch of people because of a series of unfortunate events and an upset foreign government. - shrift

Steph's analogy was a revelation for me. My marriage to Rob was hard work. I loved him, but looking back on it, we were not going to survive. I started really paying attention to those signs right before he was diagnosed with cancer, and then I felt like an ass because who in the hell thinks about leaving a spouse who just found out they have cancer?!?! I pushed all of it to the side and focused on supporting him in any way possible, and not walking out of a miserable job so we could pay for his treatment. Then he died, and I found out so many things that would have destroyed our marriage if I had discovered them while he was alive. I felt incredibly guilty that I was so angry with my husband who was dead. Everyone else was saying these amazing things about him--and they were all true--but I was the only one who knew the rest. And I felt like a heel. It took me a long time to let it go, because it wasn't going to change anything. There are still days when I get angry at him for the lies. I miss him every day, because I loved him regardless. I only ever wanted him to be happy, even if we didn't stay together.

My relationship with EMTguy? Falls right into Tep's analogy. It's worth doing what we have to do to make it work. It hasn't been easy, but what we get out of it is so much more than we've put into it.

Jesse, that's good! I never count my premiums in my head, because that's money I never see in the first place. Thanks for the reminder to look at it overall.


Calli - Aug 12, 2016 8:12:46 am PDT #25946 of 30003
I must obey the inscrutable exhortations of my soul—Calvin and Hobbs

Gud, I don't know you very well, but if even half of the stuff you say here is true, the problem in this relationship is not you.

This. Also, I don't think being in or out of a romantic relationship is indicative of goodness. I've never had a romantic relationship longer than two months, but I'm reasonably sure I'm more or less a decent person. I'm just not good at romantic relationships. There are so many other kinds of relationships out there--parental, fraternal, friendly, etc. Claiming general failure for not succeeding at one type of relationship could be like Michael Phelps saying he's a sucky athlete because his biking speeds didn't qualify him for the Tour de France.


Steph L. - Aug 12, 2016 8:19:44 am PDT #25947 of 30003
I look more rad than Lutheranism

And here's another thing: sometimes the work in a relationship/marriage isn't about working on the relationship -- it's about working on your own shit. Because oh, my god, has this relationship forced me to work on my shit (and continue to work on it). I mean, I *chose* to work on my shit because (1) I hope it makes me a better person in general, but WAY more important to me (2) I want to BE a better person IN this relationship.

I don't think I'm good enough to be in a relationship.

This? Is patently false. There is no test to determine worthiness for a relationship. Relationships are not reserved for the elites who have their shit together (hint: they don't exist). Relationships are all about being with someone who adores your flavor of wacky.

Seriously. Let me reiterate: SERIOUSLY.


Zenkitty - Aug 12, 2016 8:22:35 am PDT #25948 of 30003
Every now and then, I think I might actually be a little odd.

Gud, nobody's perfect, but damn, you are not the source of the problems, there.

I've never been in a relationship that wasn't hard work, and it wasn't rewarding work. It was a price I paid to have someone I thought I loved/needed. I've been in relationships with people who refused to see that we had any work to do, and people who insisted that all the work needed was on me to do. I'm tired of shouldering other peoples' burdens and dragging them to where they say they want to go.

After Melisa died, I found out - and came to realize - a lot of things that should/would have made me walk away. It was painful. I was really angry with her. It was so hard to feel so angry with someone I still loved, who wasn't there to work it out with me. Then someone said to me, "just because she's dead, doesn't mean she wasn't bad for you; she didn't stop being who she was when she died." (He actually said, "A dead jackass doesn't stop being a jackass," but I translated.) It made me feel better, oddly. Like, she was still a person I could have conflicting and painful feelings about.


Scrappy - Aug 12, 2016 8:24:30 am PDT #25949 of 30003
Life moves pretty fast. You don't stop and look around once in a while, you could miss it.

My DH worked very hard on his first marriage--worked three jobs to put his wife through grad school,went to counseling when she asked, put his own career goals and hobbies on hold because she didn't like them, paid all the bills--and he felt he was letting her down no matter what he did.

He said one day she was angry at him about something and he suddenly had a blinding realization "No matter how much I do, it will never be enough." That allowed him to leave the relationship and once he did that, he saw how much of his sense of himself had been eroded by being with someone who blamed him for everything wrong in her life and in herself.


Tom Scola - Aug 12, 2016 8:29:56 am PDT #25950 of 30003
Remember that the frontier of the Rebellion is everywhere. And even the smallest act of insurrection pushes our lines forward.

Mr. Scrappy is wise.


Jesse - Aug 12, 2016 8:44:58 am PDT #25951 of 30003
Sometimes I trip on how happy we could be.

Jesse, that's good! I never count my premiums in my head, because that's money I never see in the first place. Thanks for the reminder to look at it overall.

The only reason I think about it now is that my job has a system where we get to pick from a zillion choices, and now is the time we pick!

I miss him every day, because I loved him regardless. I only ever wanted him to be happy, even if we didn't stay together.

Aw, Maria. Love to you.

Also, I don't think being in or out of a romantic relationship is indicative of goodness.

THAT is the TRUTH. I mean, I know I'm awesome. I'm just not relationshippy.

And here's another thing: sometimes the work in a relationship/marriage isn't about working on the relationship -- it's about working on your own shit.

Also the TRUTH. A friend I was with last weekend is seriously thinking about whether it's worth staying in her marriage and the #1 issue is the other person's lack of willingness to work on his own shit. From the outside, at least, all of his shit looks like stuff a person could work on! But not if they don't want to.