You do get that you aren't going to win an argument with me

Revised when I realized you weren't actually trying to convince me I'm an annoying woman for using my own name. You *could* have framed the quotation better, but I won't quibble with you over that.

And sometimes doctors don't pay attention to their charts because I've been addressed as LastName, as if it were my first name or Ms. Allison as if that were my last name.

It's stupid that hyphenated names are treated as being weird. It's common enough, people need to build computers systems that deal with reality not just what once was easy.

Burrell I bet your right.

Revised when I realized you weren't actually trying to convince me I'm an annoying woman for using my own name. You *could* have framed the quotation better, but I won't quibble with you over that.

I was sort of feeling it out as I compared my experience to various complainy people on the issue.

I do think you're right that there are lot of unexamined cultural biases which make it more of a problem than it should be.

But, I'll just note that lots of institutions use out-of-the-box type database setups and the way the name fields are constructed and the way Access and MySQL deal with hyphens seems to cause problems.

(I'd be curious to hear how high level users like ita or Scola or tommyrot have dealt with the issue.)

At least people who are choosing to hyphenate their names should understand that as things currently stand, it will likely be problematic in dealing with things like insurance and medical offices or HR.

PS, did you read that bit about how my DH's name change has been smooth and problem free? No problems with the doctor's office, no medical billing rejections, no credit cards with a different name, etc. He even can file taxes with his meddlesome hyphenated name and he's never had problems with it. Magically, it's only a problem for those annoying WOMEN who hyphenate their names. I guess men do it so rarely that it's assumed it was his given name and therefore it should be treated as his actual name.

I don't know why that would be. The name field isn't gendered, so the hyphen issue should be the same for anybody.

As Hil notes, even names like O'Brien and van der Steen cause problems because most databases want to force Initial Caps on a name field.

On the one hand, this is really just a technical issue on the database side where you want to have the least amount of exceptions and you want to create datafields which are less prone to error on entry (so they force initial caps, or number fields etc.)

On the other hand, there are computer programmers in Colombia and The Netherlands who have to deal with last names which are not Jane Smith. So it's an unexamined cultural bias which winds up causing more trouble than people expect.

As a side note, it was boggling to me that when EM and I split up that the school databases could not accommodate the fact that Emmett had two home addresses. But that was the case. They invested millions in some database which presumed single-home families despite all the reality which contravened that. And once those systems are in place they're very difficult to tweak or adjust.

Personally, I have really resented the patriarchal assumption that women should change their name when they marry. This is something that has bothered me nearly my whole life.

I remember an argument I got into in high school with a teacher and another girl after I said I'd never change my last name. I was told loftily I'd feel differently after I fell in love, I'd WANT to change my name to his! I said, so then, if he loves me, why doesn't he change his name to mine? Oh, hilarity.

About the only wedding blog that I am 100% in love with is A Practical Wedding. Marvelous stuff, and has a lot of content about being a wife as well. Anyway, the woman who runs it has always wanted her hypothetical future husband to take her name. And then she met her now-husband, and when they were discussing it, he said no, he'd prefer to keep his, so they each kept theirs. Anyway, she says that whenever she tells people she wanted her husband to take her name, they laugh. They think it's a hilarious fucking joke. Gah.

But not only will my last name change, but my Ms. changes to Mrs.

Wait, isn't the point of "Ms." that it doesn't denote marriage status (as opposed to Miss v. Mrs.)

Yeah, I could go by Ms. HisLastname, but that doesn't feel right, since I will be gaining HisLastname by virtue of, indeed, being a missus.

Some of my friends were adamant about keeping their fathers' names. I've always missed the point of that, from a feminism stance--your father's name, your husband's name--it still a male relative's name.

But it's not just my father's name. I'm almost 42. It's MY name. I have lived in it, gotten a degree with it, published with it, worked with it, Tim says he can only think of me as Stephanie Lang. Not "Stephanie HerDadsName." It came from my dad, that's true, and I share it with him (but also with my mother, who kept it after the divorce so she would have the same name as her kids); this is not a society where names traditionally come from the mother. But the fact remains that it is, unquestionably, MY name.

However, I know for a fact that hyphenated or even particularly long names can be problematic for any number of systems. Last name fields are often limited to a certain number of characters.

It's a programming error. Not one that needs to exist. But it's women that hyphenate and there's a fuckton of privilege going on there.

It's problematic for people to be gay too when dealing with things like insurance and medical offices and HR. They aren't the ones that need to change.

But the fact remains that it is, unquestionably, MY name.

So, why don't you just stay Steph Lang after you marry?

Will it break Tim's heart if you don't?

It's a programming error.

Now that I've thought about and read some boards about it I'd say it's more a cultural bias. It just presumes the wrong thing at the outset.

eta: I'll amend that to say it's a cultural bias that manifests in database design a lot. And because databases are big investments that take a long time to turn over it's not going to change overnight, but somebody should start including this in their diversity training at MIT, CalTech and Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute.

I know in England there are lots of commonly hyphenated family names that go to both men and women. I wonder how they resolve the programming issue.

So, why don't you just stay Steph Lang after you marry?

Will it break Tim's heart if you don't?

Nope, it won't. But I also want his name. It's not an uncomplicated issue for me.

The point I was making w/r/t the "it's MY name" was that it's facile to say that it's still a man's name because it came from my dad. It's not the equivalent of a cattle brand that tells the world who I belong to. It's more than just my father's name, and the choice is to keep a man's name (my father) or take a man's name (my husband). The name I have came from my dad, but it's MINE.

As for whether I'll keep it, I don't know. I wouldn't be talking about it like this if it were a forgone conclusion. Lots of thinking in my future.