I think a lot of the undervaluing of fields like education and social services comes from that they are still seen as skills that fall into the traditioally female skills sets of nurturing and communication, and are therefore of less value innately than the "hard" sets of skills seen as more masculine.

That might work both ways. Time was that schoolteachers were predominantly male, and I think it was a better respected profession at that time. I'm not sure whether it became devalued as it became predominantly female, or if men became less willing to take the jobs as it became devalued. Probably fed on each other.

That might work both ways. Time was that schoolteachers were predominantly male, and I think it was a better respected profession at that time. I'm not sure whether it became devalued as it became predominantly female, or if men became less willing to take the jobs as it became devalued. Probably fed on each other.

In Great Expectations, and a lot of other books from that time period, being a clerk is seen as a great first job for a young man, a way for him to work his way up in the business world. A few decades later, and the exact same job is called a secretary and done almost entirely by women with much less respect.

My understanding is that after World War II in Russia, so many male doctors had been killed in the wars that there was a severe shortage, and the field became predominantly female, at which time respect and remuneration for doctors dropped drastically.

We now have a lot of female doctors in the US. I don't know if this is accurate or not, but my perception is that GPs are more often female and specialists are more often male. Specialists are definitely paid much better. Many have argued that the level increased pay for specialists is out of line and is harming our health care system. Is gender part of the cause? I don't know, but it's interesting.

eek! {{{WindSparrow}}} I'm glad you're OK.

Oh, that was two years ago, when I was driving that tank of a Caprice Classic. It limped back onto the road, and found a parking lot to wait things out a bit. But by the time the snow let up enough that there was actual visibility, the windshield wipers had gotten so iced up that there was no going anywhere with it. So I walked to the store at the other end of the parking lot, and called a cab to get home. As the store happened to be the the outlet/gift store for the local woolen mill, it was quite a pleasant place to warm up. They had Willow Tree angels for sale there, and I found one holding a cat, which was different from the one I already had - so I was happy to buy it and bring it home with me.

Many have argued that the level increased pay for specialists is out of line and is harming our health care system. Is gender part of the cause? I don't know, but it's interesting.

I believe that there is a theory stating that one of the reasons for disparity in pay for the sexes, is that as women begin to move into a field that was once mostly men, as the field becomes more "feminized" and so less respected, pay rates go down for everyone in the field.

The other aspect of this that I find interesting is that it seems like the few men in predominantly female fields tend to do A LOT better than women in predominantly male fields. I have noticed that male librarians tend to be be in universities and in systems or management, all areas that tend to be more highly valued. Most of the male librarians I know are fantastic - of course, most librarians I know of either gender are fantastic - but I still find it interesting.

libkitty, I'm currently taking a class in Library Management, and we all keep telling the one male in our class that he'll probably go the furthest in the field just because of his gender. Not necessarily true, but statistically, it's pretty likely.

Oh, {{{libkitty}}}. And stay safe, WindSparrow.

Also, Hil, I'm sorry to hear that. And I blame Passover for every single argument this time of year.

My understanding is that after World War II in Russia, so many male doctors had been killed in the wars that there was a severe shortage, and the field became predominantly female, at which time respect and remuneration for doctors dropped drastically.

Russia was also one of the first places where women could practice medicine to begin with. According to my long line of doctors in the part of the family that immigrated (well, more like ran for their lives) from Russia to England during the 19th century and the beginning of the 20th, two of my long distance female relatives could be doctors in Russia, but not in England. Also, the news about the benefits of washing your hands before treating patients reached England about 20 years after Russians have heard of it.

Oops. I didn't mean to kill the thread with the Russians and hands washing talk.

My mother seems to think that she's going to be getting some grandchildren soon. Or maybe it's just wishful thinking. I told her that I'm volunteering in the cat wing at the local shelter, and her first response was that I can't work with cats if I'm pregnant. Whenever she visits my sister and notices the hundred years worth of paint peeling in a few corners of her apartment, she tells her that she's going to have to get that fixed before getting pregnant. Neither of us have given her any indication that we're planning on having a baby any time soon.