What say the Bitches, was I being inappropriate?

To my ear it was somewhat inappropriate. It reads as being dismissive of the creative work involved in doing the work. I wouldn't say in front of Jackson Pollack "I could recreate that with some leftover paint and a twirl-o-paint." Art is much more than the materials involved, it's about the creative mind to combine them in such a way as to make a statement. Your statement could also have been interpreted to mean you'd have no problem creating a copy of the work, which is to me, stealing from the artist.

Again, no one is arguing that they won't. I am arguing that people who don't want to be presumed racist or xenophobic oughten't use words that they are aware will cause offense.

This. THIS.

To Jilli's question, I did specifically note the importance of context and responsibility of the speaker. I am not asserting my right call somebody names or something they consider objectionable.

You did note that. But you didn't answer my specific question. If someone tells you that you used a word they consider objectionable, would you tell them why you chose that word? Or would you apologize and say it wasn't your intent to offend?

I'm going on the theory that I'm misinterpreting what part of your stance is, because the way it is coming across TO ME is that you're dancing around at least part of the issue and just arguing for contrary argument's sake.

Part of the deal is that you don't get to decide what the "presumed damage" is.

That's the core of the argument, to me. Language is about communicating. How rich and useful are language choices if someone has to repeatedly backtrack and say "What I meant by that was [blah], not to offend anyone"?

The idea that I shouldn't be apologizing for my inability to be "cured," but that maybe some areas of my life should accommodate my needs, was a revolutionary idea.

As well as having EDS, I'm bipolar. I discovered the social model when I was very ill and unsure whether I'd ever be 'better', some years ago, and had a similar reaction to you about it. (Also, if you'd like some more links on it, Teppy, I can provide. It's what I study and research. I love this stuff.)

OK. To what extent are we losing richness in language when we accept what, for want of a better term, I'll call 'political correctness'? As a socio-linguist, and one who is fond of language change and variety, I'm not keen to see language prescribed or proscribed by others. That feels very 1984. On the other hand, there are things I don't want to hear people say - to me, at least. This is a difficult tension to maintain.

"What I meant by that was [blah], not to offend anyone"

And didn't we here or in another thread just note the guarantee that "not to offend anyone" WILL offend someone?

"Not to offend anyone, but you totally gypped me and that's lame, you crazy dyke."

And now I've made myself giggle.

Yeah, although maybe I shouldn't weigh in, as I have an icon that reads "Don't fuck this up, or I'll fuck you...I'll kill you. I love you. Bye." One of these things is not like the others...one of these things doesn't belong.I have removed both "gypped" and "retarded" although I didn't mean anything especially offensive when I said them, but I didn't really think anyone would either. I don't really miss them although shamefully I miss retarded more...I came, I conquered, I felt really bad about it.

if you'd like some more links on it, Teppy, I can provide.

I would like.

'political correctness'

Sidebar, but man do I hate the term 'political correctness.' It's almost always used as a blanket condemnation that does not acknowledge the tension to which you are referring and the complicated algorithm I mentioned earlier.

To what extent are we losing richness in language

See, I don't think we are. I'm not going to mourn every word that the bullshit consensus (or group affected) decides should not be used. Or if it was a word I liked, I'll mourn and then shrug and find another one. It's part of the evolution of language. New words are invented every day. Old ones shift meaning or fall out of favor for a number of reasons. Offense is one of those reasons, and if it hurries the process with certain words I'm cool with that.

Sidebar, but man do I hate the term 'political correctness.'

Like earlier in the thread: using inverted commas to show that I don't like the term, either. I just can't think of a better one. But I agree with you - it's mainly used as an uninformed put-down.

Will find social model stuff tomorrow, 'cos need to move laptop in a bed-ward direction, 'cos brain is fried by research. I will definitely try to find and post some, first thing, though!

I'm not going to mourn every word that the bullshit consensus (or group affected) decides should not be used. Or if it was a word I liked, I'll mourn and then shrug and find another one. It's part of the evolution of language.

I think this is a very good point. If I appreciate language change, I should try to appreciate this process too.

[link] Coates on Political Correctness.

Because he's awesomesauce.

To my ear it was somewhat inappropriate. It reads as being dismissive of the creative work involved in doing the work. I wouldn't say in front of Jackson Pollack "I could recreate that with some leftover paint and a twirl-o-paint." Art is much more than the materials involved, it's about the creative mind to combine them in such a way as to make a statement. Your statement could also have been interpreted to mean you'd have no problem creating a copy of the work, which is to me, stealing from the artist.

Fair enough, though a) I had no idea the artist was here and b) in my own defense, it's an art project I've seen done on any number of DIY, TLC, and HGTV programs as "cheap art to make your place look spendy".

To what extent are we losing richness in language when we accept what, for want of a better term, I'll call 'political correctness'? As a socio-linguist, and one who is fond of language change and variety, I'm not keen to see language prescribed or proscribed by others. That feels very 1984. On the other hand, there are things I don't want to hear people say - to me, at least. This is a difficult tension to maintain.

It seems to me that opting to re-word how a concept is expressed makes for a richer language, because it pushes writing/communication in a direction that it might not have gone. Forcing it to grow, if you will.

Also, if you'd like some more links on it, Teppy, I can provide. It's what I study and research. I love this stuff.

I would love links! Thanks!