Interesting. Several of our recent conversations in this thread seemed to have revealed that TV trends almost polar opposite to movies when it comes to subconscious bias tests like Bechdel and fridging. Apparently TV is feminist in a number of ways that film doesn't achieve on any kind of a regular basis.

I'm not sure I'd go that far. I can think of several TV shows where the protagonist has a dead wife and/or child.

I'd say it warrants further examination, but the trends do seem to be there to some degree.

I'd say there's at least enough there to conclude that, if you seek a story that passes Bechdel *and* reverses the fridging roles, you're far likelier to find such stories on TV than at the cinema.

Still, we're only generally talking about the shows we watch, and it's all very anecdotal. But it's still a tendency worth noting, I'd say.

I kind of gave up on that Nolan analysis after the woman who never existed in Memento somehow counted toward the total number of dead women. The term "confirmation bias" sprang to mind.

I have noted that love means lifelong guilt in Nolan's movies. I think that's funny, but I don't consider it a problem he needs to correct. It is true that women are not well-served in Hollywood in general, but I think it is a mistake to turn that kind of lens on an individual artist. Among other things, you create the situation you're complaining about -- if every individual female character is going to be tallied up as being a victim/bitch/saint without any context, the simplest way to avoid that criticism is to not have any female characters at all. (I am thinking of some of the criticism leveled at The Shield over Julian's character arc, because he wasn't, I dunno, a positive role model? Nobody else on that show was; why should he be spared?)

I do wish that Nolan would pick a better actresses to play the ingeniue, but I suspect that name recognition and studios play at least a small role in casting, so I'm not sure how much of his fault that is.

I dunno; the books & DVDs I own don't feature many happy, well-adjusted women, heroic women. But they don't feature many men like that either. People like that don't usually make for stories I, personally, want to see.

Unless, of course, they're pirates.

you're far likelier to find such stories on TV than at the cinema.

I think that's pretty untrue, just because of the existence of independent movies, and the controlled nature of TV. We can quantify what's on TV--yes, more of it will eventually pass the Bechdel test, but if we're to pick the first 2 hours? Probably NSM. And there are a metric shit ton of bereft male protagonists out there. I think so far Alias has been cited as a reversal for TV. That's not representing much.

People like that don't usually make for stories I, personally, want to see.

Exactly!

Unless, of course, they're pirates.

looks at movie collection

Pirates, vampires, or they kill zombies.

I totally love The Losers. I don't buy many DVDs these days, but that one I just might.

I dunno; the books & DVDs I own don't feature many happy, well-adjusted women, heroic women. But they don't feature many men like that either. People like that don't usually make for stories I, personally, want to see.

Well, yeah. My favorite fictional character is Starbuck, female version, first 1.5 seasons. It's not the morality of any given female character, it's the complexity and agency that makes her interesting and valuable.

first 1.5 seasons

it's a crying shame you have to add that in there. It's true, but it's a shame.

Just saw Inception again. Will post further thoughts tomorrow.

Dammit, Sean, Christopher Nolan is going to come to your house and steal your thoughts out of your dreams tonight!!!