How is that not reinforcing the lying? anyone havce lying mcliar toddlers at some point? how did you address it?

Yeah, I'm not really getting the therapist's POV on this. OTOH, Emmett would have a full on strike if he had to do homework over the summer. And since he's diligent about doing it during the school year I respect that. I already think he gets too much homework, and it's kind of stressful.

And it seems like it would cause problems back in the regular school year to let it slide.

On the flip side, kids don't have much in the way of autonomy or ordering their lives and it feels very oppressive to them sometimes. Lying about homework and sneaking out and other such minor offenses are a way to claim space in their lives that only belongs to them. They're not constantly accountable to somebody.

I think you'll have a huge, stressful blowout with Mac if you have to confront him about it. What I would do is say, "Look, I know you're not doing the homework. I don't want you to lie to me about it. But I don't think you really need to do a bunch of homework either. So let's take a break from homework this summer and get back to it in the fall."

You have to use it judiciously but one of the best ways to ease tension is to cut them some slack. And it has long term benefits helping to build trust and knowing that you understand them and are on their side.

I lied like a rug as a kid. Most of the time I got away with it. The real punishment was when I got caught out by my siblings.

(And what's up with her name? I wouldn't be able to say it aloud without adding "de Paul Society")

Hee.

I'm not a parent, of course, but I would think that lying should pretty much always have consequences. But maybe if she is saying let it go to focus on some other, more important, thing right now that would make sense? gah. parenting is complicated!

And this.

I should just shut up and let lisah post.

I should just shut up and let lisah post.

ooh! What else do we need to talk about?

There has been no consequence thus far for him not doing the homework, basically because the people at the program are afraid he will flip out like a mammal.

I am not sure if any other kids are not doing it.

I have no goals for the program, like I said, I would have preferred a play only summer program for him. Socialization is fine for me.

Because you don't always have to do the homework to get the stuff you really need out of school

regular school does not hold this view and not doing homework affects grades.

ooh! What else do we need to talk about?

Bangs or no bangs

Johnny Legend or Usher

Roller Derby: flat track or banked

Gibson or Fender

FWIW, I didn't do any of my math work in the 3rd grade. Evidently, since I got As on all the tests -- and read quietly when the other students were working on their sums -- the teacher let it go, which surprises me in retrospect.

But then we didn't get a whole lot of 3rd grade homework in 19(mumble).

I feel like the lying I deal with isn't comparable because it's mostly pretty artless, but I do point out to my kids that I know when a certain statement is a lie. The next thing I try to do is ask why I was told a lie and try to figure out what the desire is behind it.

Maybe that's one way to proceed with mac? I guess here the desire is obvious--not to do homework.

Hmm. If the school is not leveling any consequences then I can kinda see the therapist's point. What does the therapist think about letting mac know you know it's a lie?

There has been no consequence thus far for him not doing the homework, basically because the people at the program are afraid he will flip out like a mammal.

I know there are a lot of issues here, but I have to say I agree with you on being in *disagreement* with his therapist. I can't imagine how this isn't reinforcing exactly the wrong way to get what you want.

My approach might be to say, "You wanted this program, but you're not holding up your end of the bargain," and take some privilege away if he continues not to do the homework and/or lie about it. But I don't know what the consequences of that approach would be for *you*, so.

mac has no longerterm view of life (not that many 8 year olds do), so getting bad grades does not bother him one whit, well except that it does on some level and it reinfirces his baseline self-view that he is a no good very bad kid. So aside from being a parent that thinks he should work tokeep grades up because learning is important, I also know that it is important to his emotional stability we are working so hard to maintain and strengthen.

I guess I will just acknowledge that I know he is making a choice to not do it, will let the teacher know that I am aware of it and let her decide if she wants to have any consequences, and also let him know that come the fall homework will become a requirement that reflects on real-school grades.