It was certainly how I took the conversation with her in "Mommy Dearest." She talked about taking all the souls and leaving none for Crowley to receive in the future - that doesn't gibe with human souls going on to their regular reward/punishment when bitten.

Note too that Dean was turned into a vampire in "Live Free or Twihard," and the method used to turn him back didn't seem to involve calling a missing human soul back from the great beyond. The way Sam walking around without benefit of his soul was such a surprise to everyone seems to imply that it was kind of unprecedented, and souls normally stay with their bodies until death.

Also, did we have any evidence that Eve was connected to the monsters before she came topside?

The various monster species were all stirred up and beginning their recruitment drives well before she was summoned back by the dragons. I assume that was her doing in response to Crowley torturing her offsping for info behind the scenes.

My assumpiton was not that your soul instantly goes to purgatory when vamped or wolved, but that if you are turned into a vampire or werewolf you go to purgatory when you die. Othewise how does turning people into monsters win mother-of-all souls?

I'm just not seeing the evidence of monsters in anguish that you see as so obvious. We've had tormented monsters called out as exceptions to heighten a handful of stories, but most often it's monsters both Dean and Sam would have no hesitation putting an end to, Mr. Black and White, and Mr. 1 Million Shades of Grey themselves.

I'm not necessarily certain the dead monsters are all in a state of torment (though it wouldn't surprise me, what with apparently floating forever in a dark void with Mother-of-All and the Leviathans for company). But I would think that being linked to them and their inhuman urges and such would be destabilizing for a non-monster consciousness such as Cas' (or anybody else's).

For those who already know some Glee casting spoilers, see this item and its reference to Sam and Dean. Dude, Wincest frigging precedes us everywhere.

I would think that being linked to them and their inhuman urges and such would be destabilizing for a non-monster consciousness such as Cas' (or anybody else's).

And he was destabilised. But the souls were very different, and the situation was very different, and the results were very different so...I don't get what the problem was. I don't get what it had to do with Sam.

As for Eve's plan--she creates monsters and the souls come to her. Whether or not these souls are created by changing a human soul into a monster soul (not pasted as a fun time, but also not as bad as Luci hatebanging), or by evacuating the body of a human soul and turning it into a monster which grows a freaky monster soul--we don't know, and I doubt Sera is thinking about that.

What I saw happen to Cas was that an angel had a sudden influx of a huge number of powerful, rowdy souls who are bent on evil. He thinks he can do good with the power up gets from all of this, but he doesn't bargain on the sheer taint of the monsterness of the power to make his seemingly kind ideas come out cold, hard, and deadly.

But still able to wander around, because they're not insane. Sam is one soul, a distillation of pure torture in a cage where humans weren't meant to go, the person Luci hates....well, he's on his top 5, anyway. So the vampire soul is able to tear around Purgatory and cause whatever chaos he wanted to, seemingly--no tales of them being tied down and tortured like hell, although I wouldn't want to build a summer home there...

Versus the best torture job *ever*, No competition, no matter how many energy cells Cas swallowed. They're just nothing compared to Lucifer's finest work.

I know this is OT, but Matt Bomer is the perfect older brother for that actor. I will watch that episode.

Sneak peek #1: [link]

Man, I can't wait for an explicit booze commentary, although I'm sure they're going to muck up my alcoholic Dean fanon something fierce.

I seem to remember (but can't find a citation for) Sera saying she liked Jared bound. Does anyone have a link or a quote or anything better?

In return, I offer some, ah, circumstantial evidence: [link]

I remember back when I first started watching she was very vocal about liking to get Jared out of his shirt...

He hasn't been out of it that much, considering. I mean, we're in S7, and they've been few and far between. Homeslice sucks at her job, man. I want her fired, and replaced by someone competent.