Amy, maybe that's my lack of faith in the writing, but my overall gut reaction to the ep is that is was trying to address the issue of Dean's guilty in a tidy episode, and I don't believe they'll follow up on it. And my extreme dislike of the ep is preventing me from rewatching and deciding whether it seems like a subject that will be explored further, and again my gut reaction is that it won't. My takeaway was that this was it, and they'll be moving on to other subjects in other episodes, and there will be no follow-through on the topic of Dean's guilt.

I can't articulate why this struck me as a one-shot afterschool special episode, or why I feel like Show seems to be done with the topic. Maybe I'm being irrational about it.

I wish I was smarter and better able to explain the disappointment I felt with that ep or the lack of hope it left me with on that particular subject.

I guess. . . I guess it just didn't feel like the beginning of a character arc. I've had plenty of opportunities to be faithless at the prospect of a character arc, haven't, and been disappointed, although right now I can't recall when I thought something wasn't truly explored. But something about this ep made it seem like it was trying too hard to tackle all of Dean's guilty, failing, and while I know more needs to be addressed, I just don't see it happening. Just by the very existence of the episode and now it went about dealing with Dean's guilt.

I don't think it's accurate to call it a one shot, since Dean has been pretty clearly torn up by this sort of displaced responsibility his whole life. I think the point was made that they've wrestled it down to non overwhelming noise for the moment, and forty two minutes seems fair to take for that. Much longer would be tiresome to me, honestly. But I did like the ep, so there's that.

Now, if they get him off the sauce in one ep, I will totally feel cheated.

Good god. Am I reading this right? Was SPN seriously the cheapest CW (and therefore probably cheapest period) show to advertise on? Cheaper than Hellcats?

I'm not sure the drinking and guilt can be separated from grief and despair and ingrained habits. I think part of this season is going to be about Dean's spiral. He's the one who's shouldered on every time, who never really breaks. Sam has, a few times over, and Dean's due.

And I think the whole season so far has built toward that. This episode sort of proved his mental health is *not* over with, because Sam showed him a way to get through, and he couldn't take it. He's compounding his guilt by not telling about Amy, and he knows it.

I had this feeling, watching the ep, that a few seasons ago, it would have been a Trickster ep. Gabriel was a good instrument for addressing this shit without it being totally ASS. Osiris*, unfortunately, was no Trickster.

* What's the line in American Gods about the feather being remarkably heavy?

Amy, I totally see the downward-spiral arc, although I'm not sure where they can really go with it.

Yeah, that's the hard part, Debet. He was so close to breaking entirely when he ran away to go say yes to Michael, I don't see them doing that again. But something has to happen.

I trust Sera, actually.

I trust Sera too. It's interesting to see how far they can bend Dean without breaking. If you had asked me back in Croatoan, I would have said he couldn't take any more. But he found the strength to carry on his wayward son.

I've been through so many times that I wouldn't have blamed Dean for saying "enough" but he keeps going. At least his body keeps moving. It will be interesting to see if there actually is a breaking point, rather than a more damaged point.

"i've been through" = I've watched Dean go through. I haven't actually gone through shit. But I felt like I have with the boys. I couldn't have been more proud of Sam when he was explaining his mental health if I had been Mary herself. Good for you, boys. It's been hard watching you grow up.

::nods::

What Theresa said.

It does feel like maybe the writers are about to acknowledge that Dean isn't, ultimately, indestructible. And that Sam may be moreso than he or anyone else ever thought. I live in hope that finally, finally, Dean gets to break, and Sam gets to caretake, and they come out the other side as equals, adults, with the ballast of family and history behind them, but a fairly clean slate ahead of them. It's nice to think so, briefly, anyway.

From the same page with "life in motels" was a link to this video [link] I wish that I would be dead. Since we were talking about breaking points. So many good moments included here. Wee Sam with Dean and the fireworks may be one of my all time favorites. Ending with Sam hugging Dean in Mystery Spot wasn't bad either.

eta: Did you guys remember the look on Sam's face when he was walking toward Dean (and therefore everything was okay) right before Hardison stabbed him in the back? Gutting.

Is it really a Wincesty video? Don't want to watch in that case.

Hardison stabbed him in the back?

Take that back! Hardison would be buds with Sam! Separation! Separation!