Why are we whitefonting the promo?

That was ... that was painful. So much hugging and healing needs to be done. So much longing looks fraught with betrayal and pain.

There could have been a way to pitch this to Dean as an extension of the unpleasantness of initially working with Crowley, but that ship has sailed. Crowley doesn't want to work with them.

And I guess I see why Cas was all "Leave the soul!" Because he'd tried and he couldn't get it.

That's the difference between lifting someone from perdition and gripping them tight and lifting them from perdition. Handprint, profound bond, and fanon blowjobs.

I...

I'm not sure how much closer to the surface that subtext could have got. In fact, I think it kind of went over and above the text, making the text its bitch. It's entirely possible we just experienced domtext.

With bonus eye fucking.

Heh. There was a pregnant pause at one point where Castiel might as well have said, "Because I love you, Dean!"

Dang, Castiel wore me out with his despair.

Also Evolution as Canon FTW!

Also Also, Misha has dreamy eyes.

So, they are mad at Cas because Cas is dealing with Crowley even though not dealing with Crowley means they have to go through Armagedon again and probably the whole vesseldom thing? Are they saying if Cas had tried this before Armagedon had been averted the first time, they would still have been against it? Wouldn't Dean have done anything in Stull cemetery to keep his brother if he could? Isn't that what Cas is doing?

I'm so confused. Is it dealing with a demon or opening purgatory that is the deal breaker for the Winchesters? Opening purgatory would be bad but surely less bad than Satan walking the earth?

I am feeling pretty morally corrupt here because I don't understand what Cas is doing wrong. He asked God for a sign or permission. He's still on the side of "good" and trying to save the Earth.

He made a deal with a demon. only Winchesters get to do that That never ends well

Maybe the reason he is wrong is because he lied. Dean certainly complained about his lying and, after all, Winchesters never lie.

I am feeling pretty morally corrupt here because I don't understand what Cas is doing wrong. He asked God for a sign or permission. He's still on the side of "good" and trying to save the Earth.

He made a deal with a demon.

Maybe the reason he is wrong is because he lied. Dean certainly complained about his lying

This is all a repetition of the "Sam, you betrayed me for a demon!" outrage we had in season ... 4, I think? (the episode where Dean walked away from Sam outside of Bobby's hospital).

I had the same problems with a lot of Sam's actions Theresa mentions -- he was trying to use his abiilities (up until he killed the nurse, because I can't defend that) for good. He was trying to save the earth. And everyone was telling him to stop, just like the Winchesters and Bobby are now telling Castiel that he shouldn't be following his plan of action. That he shouldn't have made a deal with Crowley (Sam, you chose that demon bitch over your brother and I just can't forgive that), and that he's been spying on them and lying (and God knows we saw endless arguments and accusations about lying and sneaking around.

Maybe this means that when Dean said that Castiel is part of the family it really is true. He's a Winchester now. Same behavior patterns, same arguments, same strengths.

That certainly fits with the "I'm not going to logic you. I'm telling you/asking you to stop." Cause I guess "like family" equals "follow Dean's orders".

Did Cas actually tell Team Free Will that if Raphael wins, it's Armageddon 2.0?

Why, oh, why can the good guys never seem to communicate properly?

I would have loved Cas's next line to have been something like, "If you can tell me any other way, I will"

Did Cas actually tell Team Free Will that if Raphael wins, it's Armageddon 2.0?

Yes. I'm pretty sure it's been made clear that Raphael wants to restart everything. Either he said so, or Cas did.

I get why Dean is so gutted, but I'm unsure about everyone else. Dean has betrayal/abandonment issues up the wazoo, and one of the three people (I note he didn't call Ben and Lisa family, which is incredibly sad) in his orbit is majorly lying to him.

Bobby? Maybe because Crowley decided to gallivant off with his soul?

Maybe Sam gets that Crowley can't be on the up and up?

But mostly, I think Dean is operating out of deep hurt right now, and that's pretty typical.

If Cas had gotten Sam all the way out of the cage, would he have copped to it (he should have gripped him tight too, dammit, not just raised him from perdition)? How was Samuel resurrected?

I guess that's also it--Cas didn't only lie, he manipulated them. Maybe if they'd been collecting monsters for him, it wouldn't have been such a miserable part of Dean's life.