Well, since Cas is apparently in some sort of cahoots with Crowley, maybe he planted another of those tracking coins on Dean. Or in Dean--the "hows" and "where" to be determined by the fic writer/artist of your choice.

I want to tell someone she's got the rules wrong. Sam or Dean can't be Cas's vessel unless you do some fanwanking heavy lifting. You can't just say "that'd be cool" and leave it there. That's not how you play.

Also, get over myself.

Speaking of myself. And Supernatural...am I being hard on a character I purport to love if I just really don't envision a domestic happy ending for Dean? Reading other places, you'd think you'd have to be a bitch to want him to hunt just one more second, but I want him to keep hunting, and I want him to be happy doing it, and I think the text totally allows me to project that as a happy ending for him.

Not the ultimate curtains, perhaps, but that's why I could never ship him with most of the women on the show bar Jo. And even that was mostly sex. He just...I like him on the road and agil.

Even Sam, I get sadface if he's paired with anyone other than Sarah, because I feel her letting him hunt is predestined in a way Dean never even managed with Lisa (because that was never going to work, simply).

But, I swear, to some parts of fandom, I'm a big old meanie who can't possibly love Dean the mostest. And I absolutely do.

I don't think you're the *biggest* meanie, because I agree with you in part. But I'm not sure I agree he would be happy hunting until his card is punched because he enjoys it. I think part of him is always, now, going to be making reparations for his time in hell, and before that he was programmed for too long to believe that innocent people needed saving from the same kind of *hell* he lived as a child, with his father broken and his mother dead and his baby brother essentially abandoned to his care.

I think he's seen too much, or knows too much about just how evil the world can be, in other words. And while I think he would still absolutely enjoy being on the road with Sam, especially hunting the simpler things (ghosts, werewolves, etc.), I think there's a part of him that really longs for companionship, and the emotional safety of someone who loves him.

I don't know if Lisa could ever be that, despite her intentions, because Ben will always come first. And having Ben in the picture changes things from Dean's perspective, too.

I guess I should change my answer to say I'm not sure Dean's ever going to be *at peace*.

You're making it sound like Dean can't be fulfilled with someone with kids. And there's the implication that Dean can never return what you say he needs, because of Sam.

Not that parity of that sort is required for a successful relationship--it's just a note.

I don't think Dean wants to have the weight of the world on his shoulders every year, but I do believe that the act of saving lives can be rewarding for him, and why not this versus EMT or firefighter or cop?

I do believe that the act of saving lives can be rewarding for him, and why not this versus EMT or firefighter or cop?

Well, most firefighters or cops have families and homes to go to at the end of the shift.

I don't see Dean as completely doomed to angst, but there's a difference between saving lives because you feel like you have to and doing it because you want to. What I got from him leaving Lisa and Ben the last time is that he doesn't feel like he has a choice, and he feels they're better off without him around. I think that might be different if Ben weren't in the picture -- an adult can consent to risk but you shouldn't ask that of a kid, which Dean knows firsthand.

I would love to see Dean settle down eventually, with someone to love, even with kids, but when I look critically at canon, I'm not sure it's really in the cards for him, even though I really believe part of him loved the life he built with Lisa.

Edited because I should have proofread the first time.

Well, most firefighters or cops have families and homes to go to at the end of the shift.

And in fiction, they're coming home to a spouse that's all "Wahh! Wouldn't you rather sex me up than save an innocent life? I don't get you! Where are your priorities? Why haven't you changed?" Thank DOG SPN has never gone there. But, really, supportive home life is not something stories put forward too often for people out risking their lives for others. I'm not sure why that is.

I would *love* in general stories if the cops wives and husbands were all "That's my hottie out there, saving lives and kicking asses!" And, SPNwise, I can kinda handle it for Sam. I mean, as long as he's out there hunting with Dean still. That's pretty much mandatory.

I'm not sure why I don't see it for Dean. Or want it for Dean. I just think that the first time Dean left Lisa and Ben he did it because he wanted to hunt too. Not because he was a monster, but because he was a hunter. It's his thing. He's good at it, and it rewards him.

I guess I'm erasing the damage John did to him, and his rock bottom self esteem, but the love of a good woman won't fix that for him either. He needs to get healthy and hunt, or get healthy and stop hunting.

but when I look critically at canon, I'm not sure it's really in the cards for him, even though I really believe part of him loved the life he built with Lisa.

Part of the problem there was that he stepped into an existing family unit with virtually no transition. So he really didn't build that life, he tried it on.

If it had a more natural genesis - hunting still, but pulling back enough maybe by starting with an actual home base, then non-Sam, non-hunting relationships with actual people and the hunting became less a mission and more an avocation as other priorities were allowed to take hold?

I don't know that I'm convinced it would work. But it feels a lot more realistic than parachuting in and calling it family.

I was thinking about real-life cops and firefighters, and being sort of blithe about it, because the divorce rate is insanely high for both, I'm pretty sure. It can't be easy to be a good spouse when half of what you see every day is horror, or when every day you're sitting home hoping a uniform's not going to show up at your door with bad news.

I love the fact that my grandfather was a career firefighter, but I also didn't live through those years worrying.

Anyway. My ultimate fantasies of happy endings for Sam and Dean only play off canon in the barest way, really. One of them is them settling down somewhere, even Bobby's, and training young hunters, hopefully each with a spouse or SO of their own, and the occasional case to keep them in the game.

What gets in the way is my *own* need for a home, I think, and it's easy to grab onto John talking about how much he wanted a home for Dean (and Dean's sheer joy with it in WIaWSNB). I don't really think canon Dean wants a home so much as family -- that sense of people who have your back no matter what, people you love and who love you.

That line of Dean's about just that in And Then There Were None killed me for that reason. Actually, all the times he and Bobby both have referred to each other as family.

If it had a more natural genesis - hunting still, but pulling back enough maybe by starting with an actual home base, then non-Sam, non-hunting relationships with actual people and the hunting became less a mission and more an avocation as other priorities were allowed to take hold?

Yes. This. I see it as a transition rather than a firm departure. I would also see Dean trying to leave the hunting life more than once before settling into a sort of coexistence with it. I could see him ending up in a similar situation to Bobby's--running a legitimate business of some sort while still hunting as occasion demanded. Heck, I could even see him finding his own version of a Sheriff Mills, in terms of an authority figure who would drag him in if something got a bit weirder than normal protocol could handle.

OMG I WANT DEAN ON THE ROAD FOREVER SHUT UP YOU GUYS.

THERE WILL BE NO REST.

THEY WILL NEVER BE DONE.

WAYWARD 4 LYFE!!!!