Hee. I love Jen & her delusion. I am so far on her side that I didn't end up watching the show! Heh. I would have gone ballistic. I can't stand that sort of ending, not the least because we do periodically have to deal with actual suicide, and it doesn't have any shiny or happy or 70s on it at all.
Willow: It feels like we're going around in circles. Xander: Our circles are going around in circles. We got dizzy circles here.
'Sleeper'
Boxed Set, Vol. V: Just a Hint of Denial and a Dash of Retcon
A topic for the discussion of Doctor Who, Arrow, and The Flash. Beware possible invasions of iZombie, Sleepy Hollow, or pretty much any other "genre" (read: sci fi, superhero, or fantasy) show that captures our fancy. Expect adult content and discussion of the Big Gay Sex.
Marvel superheroes are discussed over at the MCU thread.
Whitefont all unaired in the U.S. ep discussion, identifying it as such, and including the show and ep title in blackfont.
Blackfont is allowed after the show has aired on the east coast.
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Liese S. - Mar 03, 2009 4:59:57 pm PST #7065 of 30001
"Faded like the lilac, he thought."
§ ita § - Mar 03, 2009 5:02:28 pm PST #7066 of 30001
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.
I don't think it was portrayed as either shiny or happy. I mean, when it's made apparent, it's a sad moment. It's the preferable choice, but I still found it sad.
JenP - Mar 03, 2009 5:09:39 pm PST #7067 of 30001
Exactly, which is why I didn't like it. I didn't think it was shiny or happy either; I'm saying, I wanted something shiny and happy. Sucked for me, but... was what it was.
Oh, der. You were responding to Liese. I just wanted to be clear that I found no shiny or happy there.
Liese S. - Mar 03, 2009 5:13:04 pm PST #7068 of 30001
"Faded like the lilac, he thought."
I guess that's the thing, though, right? That there was a choice to be made and in the end suicide was the best choice. Suicide was what was necessary to be happy, or at least to avoid a worse sadness. That's not a show that I could have enjoyed given that it ended that way.
Liese S. - Mar 03, 2009 5:12:47 pm PST #7069 of 30001
"Faded like the lilac, he thought."
Which is a shame to me because from everything else I heard about it I would have otherwise really really loved it. But that's just where my headspace was at the time it was airing.
JenP - Mar 03, 2009 5:27:25 pm PST #7070 of 30001
Totally get that. It's like I have this "Wait, Ben and Glory are related?" glamour about the end... it's in place most of the time.
It really was a fantastic show.
§ ita § - Mar 03, 2009 5:37:15 pm PST #7071 of 30001
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.
I think there's a distinction between happy and less sad, and I think the show was quite clear about him avoiding a deep unhappiness. (eta: to Liese, and not to disagree with you, Jen)
Frankenbuddha - Mar 03, 2009 5:41:19 pm PST #7072 of 30001
"We are the Goon Squad and we're coming to town...Beep! Beep!" - David Bowie, "Fashion"
This is a fascinating conversation. I haven't seen more than a few episodes of either version of the show, but the debate reminds me of when Terry Gilliam said he thought BRAZIL had a happy ending because Sam did get away in the end, even if it was only in his own head.
Frankenbuddha - Mar 03, 2009 5:47:44 pm PST #7073 of 30001
"We are the Goon Squad and we're coming to town...Beep! Beep!" - David Bowie, "Fashion"
Also, the REAPER premiere? Sock is just making me want to quit this show. Given how far they've come along with Morgan from CHUCK, I'd just like a little modulation here. Ray Wise is still awesome, however.
§ ita § - Mar 03, 2009 5:49:23 pm PST #7074 of 30001
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.
I think you can read LoM that way, Frank, but I don't think the show tries to convince you of that, which is the big distinction fo rme.