Apparently W13 needs proactive saving: [link] I am skeptical about the point of all that.

I feel like a lot of shows would have made crystal clear by now that it's perfectly okay for Ollie to kill bad guys

I feel they have, though. Everyone's issues with it seem at best decorative.

I don't, I feel like the question is still open (although perhaps not to most of the characters, which is a fine distinction, I know) and they may yet make it a real issue.

What I'm comparing it to is, well, Stargate Atlantis comes to mind, where storylines would raise thorny questions but then events of the plot or reveals would just make those questions not apply to this particular case.

While Ollie certainly thinks he's in the right, and Laurel and Diggs and Tommy and everyone but Cop Daddy, I guess, agrees, there's room for the audience to disagree and events may yet show that Ollie et al are, in fact, wrong.

Apparently Laurel would still be on his side if she knew the truth, though, and the impact of Diggs disagreeing with him has been minimal.

I would only disagree with you re: SGA in that they didn't treat anything like it was thorny--it was only the audience thinking it was fucked up that defined problematic--the universe didn't even hiccough at SG-instigated genocide, for instance. It might be troublesome but ethically abhorrent? Pfah!

I think a show like Nikita does a better job of "our protagonist is making dodgy calls here, and the script buys into it wholeheartedly" even though Nikita usually comes out shiny, it's not always. And the other people on her side differ with her often and stridently and with reverberations past the top of the hour.

You are right on both counts. I appreciate that Arrow is not quite as blithe as SGA was, which is a low bar but sometimes I have low bars.

Nikita is way more interesting ethically, no doubt, they really dig in to thorny questions on that show. Which I love. Among other things: there's so much to love about Nikita.

the impact of Diggs disagreeing with him has been minimal.

And Digg tossed his disagreement out the window when he found out Deadshot was still alive. They're grey-area-ing all over the place.

Cop Daddy's lecture to Roy and Thea in this episode was the strongest argument I've seen the show take (and he's right, not just legally, but from a Who Watches the Watchmen? standpoint), but I feel like his lecture was just to set up Roy's resolve to find the hood guy (and, one presumes, join him [seriously, I am in love with his red hoodie]).

Steph, I know you don't watch Teen Wolf, but it did come up that Colton used to be on that show. Because the writers of that show enjoy amusing themselves, they put the unpowered protagonist in a red hoodie, and it's now a symbol of the people that ship him with the show's good boy big bad werewolf, so the idea that Colton is wearing one for completely different reasons (again, part of a story that predates the show) in his new universe amuses me.

I don't actually like either character he's played, so I'm happy that something about him amuses me. I can't help but see Abercrombie and Fitch when I look at him, so "street kid who longs for something true" is not something I'm buying in the least.

I can't help but see Abercrombie and Fitch when I look at him,

He's kind of the same type, physically as Luke from The O.C. (who was also an A&F model, right?).

so "street kid who longs for something true" is not something I'm buying in the least.

I'm not getting that from him, either. I feel like he's just there because the writers/showrunners wanted a Roy Harper, and so they're moving him around to get him into sidekick position.

Unrelatedly: watching Face Off has definitely affected how I see the aliens on DS9. There was just a reveal of some dimly lit Jem'Hadar and my first thought was "ooh, nice profiles"

The whole freezing the fire demon with nitrogen thing on Grimm was pretty cool! And the still glowing eyes in the obsidian super creepy.

I like what they are doing with Juliet's memory thing lately, too.

I liked that none of them really knew what the thing was, just what it had done in the past. It pretty definitely wasn't Wesen.