Oh, I mourn stuff. But I am also really really okay with letting things lie.

On the flip side, I got into a big argument (this is where you do your shocked face) with a guy about ending shows. He was complaining about shows going on too long, and Story suffering, and I said--just turn off your TV! They'll cancel it soon enough, no worries. You can stop watching any time--it's not their fault if you don't, and why not let anyone else who's still getting enjoyment out of it squeak by with some extra fun on their screen?

Oh, no, Story will be tarnished. Dude, Buffy doesn't have a GPA or a rebound average she needs to maintain. Feel free to only buy the boxed set up through season 5, and leave other people to get what they can out of the rest. Everything is always cancelled too soon for someone. Just consider yourself lucky it's not you in this case, but why bother complain something's being cancelled too late? If SMG doesn't want a new job yet, it's her call. Not indentured servitude.

Sorry--I've just had so many "arguments" with people who want Supernatural cancelled because they stopped watching after season 5. YOU STOPPED WATCHING. What difference does it make if it's on air or not? You need the timeslot for something else?

eta: ha! I totally wrote this before reading your post, Consuela, but I stand by it 100%. The concept of "tarnishing" a show is completely useless to me. Completely.

What difference does it make if it's on air or not? You need the timeslot for something else?

I suppose it would free up the actors and creators to go on to other projects you might like better.

(I suppose I should add: I'm still following the show and enjoying it.)

Hmmm... For me it depends. I haven’t watched the Simpsons in 15 years, and I just don’t give a damn about it. But I also remember being extremely annoyed at how bad the X-Files got; I kept watching that for longer than I should hoping it would start to make sense.

I've just had so many "arguments" with people who want Supernatural cancelled because they stopped watching after season 5. YOU STOPPED WATCHING. What difference does it make if it's on air or not? You need the timeslot for something else?

Heh. Well, there is the zero-sum school of thought, where Dollhouse got a second season but Sarah Connor didn't, and therefore the one was at the cost of the other.

In general, I don't think SPN should have been cancelled: as you say, I took my leave. But I wouldn't like to tell people they don't have a right to feel that their emotional investment in a show has been hurt when the show goes places they didn't expect in the first couple of seasons, or even degrades in quality (nobody thinks Farscape S4 is the best overall season, although there are some very good episodes in it).

A friend of mine has a theory that the average tv concept has, at best, 100 good episodes in it. After that, the writers have run out of things to say about the characters and the premise, and end up repeating themselves or reinventing the show. Which I think isn't that far wrong, if you look at shows like SG-1, in which season 8 doesn't look much like season 2, and for some people might as well be a different show altogether--different cast, different enemy, different constraints.

SPN season 7 is, by all accounts, not much like season 2: different enemy, different constraints, different assumptions. And people like it, so clearly there's something worthwhile there. But for me, the whole angel-armageddon-destined vessel storyline was so far from the story I'd originally attached to that it just lost me (among other reasons).

I think it's just hard for some people to accept that the show is different now, and rather than deal with their inability to follow it emotionally, they would rather have it end at what was, to them, a high point.

But back to my original point: if the showrunners can't change the premises or the cast, and just keep telling the same stories over and over--well, that is almost inevitably going to result in some degradation of quality. How can it not?

And I know enough about what was going on behind the scenes at Farscape to know that the battles with the network weren't going to get any better--they wanted more accessibility, less complicated serial storytelling, more "casual-viewer-friendly" episodes. And that was almost precisely what Farscape hadn't been since about midway through season 1. I suspect that if that battle had continued on, without cancellation, well. The outcome wouldn't have been pretty.

the average tv concept has, at best, 100 good episodes in it. After that, the writers have run out of things to say about the characters and the premise, and end up repeating themselves or reinventing the show

That sounds about right to me - 5 seasons seems to be that sweet spot where you either get canceled or go completely off the rails.

John Rogers has said the same thing, specifically about Leverage: that a show concept has only got so many episodes in it before it starts to go stale.

But the actors and creators can actually leave if they want--that's why some series end when they do. Because people are ready to move on. There are remarkably few indentured servants in Hollywood.

I'm not saying that anyone should keep liking the show once it's started to suck, or be happy it now sucks. Just, why wish it cancelled? You go from not watching a show on the air to not watching a show off the air--you're still not watching the show--what in hell do you care if it's on the air? Basically the people who were watching the show are bummed out now. That's what just happened. Great. Why can't you take responsibility for not watching it yourself? I can't see the whole thing as anything other than "well, if I can't have it, no one will!" sort of petty.

And the zero sum school of thought isn't handing out diplomas, since it's not usually that simple, so I don't factor it in much either.

What does "emotional investment has been hurt" mean? And if we're going to possibly harm a metaphor, why can't you close your account before the bank goes belly up?

So John has said that thing, about Leverage ending? Cool.

I don't think a given TV concept can't write more than 100 episodes into the very DNA, but I'm absolutely not clever enough to create the idea that gives birth to itself. Just that it should be plausible to satisfy those stipulations.

Though, for instance, you can minimise the impact of repeating yourself, right?

I can't see the whole thing as anything other than "well, if I can't have it, no one will!" sort of petty.

Well, yeah. People are petty. Especially when they feel (logically or not) that they were sold a chocolate ice cream but down at the bottom it's become black raspberry, and they hate black raspberry.

What does "emotional investment has been hurt" mean?

Eh, bad writing on my part. I mean the feeling that you've thrown bad money after good, that you're clinging to something that you dislike because of the emotional attachment you built up when you did like it, and the hope that this is just a temporary thing and soon it will return to what it was before and you'll like it again. Or like it more than you dislike it, anyway.

And if we're going to possibly harm a metaphor, why can't you close your account before the bank goes belly up?

Because you can't know. There are probably fans who can go from being really emotionally attached to a show to being casual about it, but they're not that common. The whole point of fannishness is that emotional connection, which is why it's so hard to let go when the pain begins to outweigh the pleasure. Especially if you don't know if it's just temporary, and soon it'll be something you like again. So instead of going from completely invested to casual, they go from completely invested to totally pissed off, because they hung in so long that the pain completely overwhelmed the pleasure.

I'm sort of struggling with this right now--last season's Fringe took a story about Olivia and turned it into a story about Peter and how much Olivia loved him, which was for me, definitely not the show I became attached to. And now I have to decide whether the new premise this season promises is going to be enough to bring me back, or do I walk away, as I planned to? Will it be better? Will the parts I dislike outweigh the parts I like? If I make a lot of noise about the parts I dislike, will that magically make the showrunners change the story? [Answer to that last: NO. But people keep trying, anyway.]

How do I get the pleasure of the show while protecting myself from being pissed off by the parts I don't like? ::shrugs::

But Consuela - you know that this upcoming season is it's last.

(Mmmmm, love chocolate ice cream AND black raspberry.)