Boxed Set, Vol. V: Just a Hint of Denial and a Dash of Retcon
A topic for the discussion of Doctor Who, Arrow, and The Flash. Beware possible invasions of iZombie, Sleepy Hollow, or pretty much any other "genre" (read: sci fi, superhero, or fantasy) show that captures our fancy. Expect adult content and discussion of the Big Gay Sex.
Marvel superheroes are discussed over at the MCU thread.
Whitefont all unaired in the U.S. ep discussion, identifying it as such, and including the show and ep title in blackfont.
Blackfont is allowed after the show has aired on the east coast.
This is NOT a general TV discussion thread.
I think they waited until the Final 5 were in place before they attacked.
To tie everything in to Helo, because that's still fun: if Helo hadn't given up his seat to Baltar, he wouldn't have been on Caprica when Starbuck came for the Arrow of Apollo. And then Starbuck wouldn't have lost her Raider, gotten stuck on Caprica, run into the resistance, and subsequently brought Anders to the fleet.
All of which is to say: I think it's fate, not a plan.
Jessica -- Oh totally; it's only the FF that I think are older. (Though I will quibble that I honestly don't think the Cylons have ever said anything about how long the seven known models have been around.)
I just popped out of almost falling asleep and decided that I wanted Lee to be the final Cylon, and then found out that's where almost everyone else's money is over at TWoP. Poo, that most likely means it won't be true. I was just imagining all the fun that could be had with Roslin/Lee, Starbuck/Lee, Adama/Lee, and then I thought of the crazy crazy fun that might happen with Gaius/Lee and ChipSix telling him that Lee is a Cylon, the Krazy Kult overhearing Gaius' repetition and thinking it a declaration from God and getting out their pitchforks and then maybe Gaius saves Lee from the mob, only to die himself, and Roslin airlocks Lee's ass, and Kara caps Roslin, and Zarek becomes president, and then Lee comes back and nukes all their asses... And maybe before all the death and stuff Anders and Lee could have some fun romps and escapades and bonding over their Cylonosity.
Um, sleep, now, yes? Okay.
Huh, apparently there may be a plan afoot to save Jericho via some sort of Comcast/CBS deal - similar to the NBC/Direct tV deal that saved FNL.
But how could Lee be the final Cylon? Wasn't his father there when he was conceived/born/growing?
If Roslin is the final Cylon, then I want some sort of explanation as to how she ended up President of the Colonies. I mean, it can't just be chance that the final Cylon ends up as the President.
I had also assumed the the final five were one of a kind. Not sure why - from the beginning, there was the thing about "12 models" but they seem to talk about them as individuals.
Dear Ron Moore,
Please let this be cool and not a large floating red ball and a zombie virus and a polar bear. The Cylons have a plan. Please tell me that you do also.
One of the main things I'd like explored before the series finale is why the cylons at once seem to want to kill every last human, then they seem to want to control them and/or protect them. They definitely send mixed messages. I don't get what they are really after and why such things seemed to change over the three seasons.
Here's an idea I have brought on by the descriptions of Caprica - the series. Apparently Bill Adama's grandfather was really into experimentation for cylon-human hybrids. So what if Adama is a cylon (one of the final 5)?
I hope that's not where they go because that sounds fucked up to me.
All of which is to say: I think it's fate, not a plan.
Or Helo is the last unrevealed Cylon and is the only one programmed with the real plan!
(Okay, I don't really think that. But man, he does seem to have inadvertantly caused a bunch of important stuff to happen, didn't he?)
One of the main things I'd like explored before the series finale is why the cylons at once seem to want to kill every last human, then they seem to want to control them and/or protect them.
Daddy issues.
Please let this be cool and not a large floating red ball and a zombie virus and a polar bear. The Cylons have a plan. Please tell me that you do also.
I'm pretty sure there's no plan. Or, if there is, it's not the same plan the creators imagined it would be at the beginning of the show.
very disappointing.
Which is not to say that I wouldn't want everything to be tied to Helo. If everything could include me, that is.
I'm pretty sure there's no plan. Or, if there is, it's not the same plan the creators imagined it would be at the beginning of the show.
I don't know. I mean, I don't really have any idea whether, on a meta level, there was a master plan. But I don't see the show having gone in directions that it can't be hauled back from, either.
Watching some of the marathon last week, particularly the Caprica/New Caprica bits, I grasped more than I had before about the role of Boomer and Caprica Six in what later happened on N.C. - I hadn't really picked up on that before, and it helped. I wish they'd put a little more focus there, actually, because I think it's critical what's happening with/to the Cylons.
Reall, a lot of the craxy of the Cylons and what seems like a lack of direction has to do with individuality among the Cylons, with one (or more) among each model developing a real individual identity, and how completely that upends their society and their path. Boomer, Athena, Caprica, the main D'Anna. (Also possibly one or more of the Leobens? Though so far that impact has been confined to Kara.) They're dragging the collective Cylon society off in weird directions with their own, highly individual, motivations. And that's something that
shouldn't be possible
based on what the Cylons understand and believe about themselves. And now with the Five, who we don't know nearly enough about but who certainly seem to be one-offs, with an identity (and history, and destiny?) distinct from that of the others.
My thought on the Final Five is that they are capable of growing/aging, and maybe all the 12 models are, but the other 7 chose not to upload after death into their new baby bodies (sorta like reincarnation) because they were impatient and didn't want to bother with the wisdom that comes with a lifetime of growing up, so they built adult models and then there was a fundamental rift.
Or maybe the Final Five are capable of uploading into human babies after death.
One thing that confuses me about the Centurion and Humlons is that my brain keeps wanting the Humlons to have come first and built the Centurions and raiders as their dumb soldiers and guard dogs. But I
think
it was the other way around, but, I can't see these Centurions having any emotion or desire to rebel against their creators, and I certainly can't see them as having the intelligence to create the humlons. And then there's Six and Doral? talking about how humans are their parents and parents must die to make way for the children, but this is a surprise to the humans that there are humlons. How can they be surprised if they made them (I know, it was a big big secret nobody knew about). And my other gripe that I've been holding onto ever since the mini-series was how the hell did Adama know Leoben (or whomever that incarnation was) was a Cylon if humlons were a big sooper seekrit surprise to humanity at large. CKR was sweaty gross? That's kinda right up there with thinking that because four of you heard the same song, you must be Cylons.
So I'm pointing my finger at Adama for having more involvement in the Cylons and the Cylon war than we originally were led to believe. And would explain why Boomer was triggered to shoot him at the end of season 1. He's involved somehow. And maybe Kara and Lee are the original hybrids like Hera. Maybe Adama's one of the original hybrids and Lee's a second generation hybrid.
Coffee. Now.
