but no one else was the subject of a wish.

::hands out graduate degree in handwavium mechanics::

For me, the main plot *was* about Wes, as an object lesson in how wishing goes wrong. And I thought they accomplished that.

Rape is wrong. Wrong like a really wrong thing. But this isn't Law and Order or CSI, the relative "reality" of those shows aside. Supernatural isn't exploring real-life crime, and presenting it mostly realistically. It's using paranormal storylines as metaphors. It's just as awful for me to watch some random guy swallowing razor blades as it is to think that this woman had no idea what she was doing for a month, including having sex with a man it's clear she didn't even know.

But there's an apples and oranges thing at work for me here -- it's the *idea* I'm watching for, that metaphor of watching what you wish for, or how love can be dangerously obsessive, or anger taking root so deeply it manifests (not to mention the ongoing story of Sam and Dean). If this had been Law and Order, and they showed a woman who had been kidnapped and raped for a month, the point of the plot would be to find the perpetrator and punish him, as well as show the traumatic consequences to the victim.

Here, for me, it was abundantly clear that what Wes had done was awful, for him as well as for Hope. The *idea* that wishing for something might turn out horribly wrong came across loud and clear. Honestly, I didn't need Show to then cover how awful it was for Hope. I'm not sure what purpose it would serve in the context of this 42-minute plot. That's ... another show, in my mind.

But I don't think Show was patently putting a seal of approval on rape, either. Were they conveniently glossing it over by having her not remember? I guess you can look at it that way, if you're looking at it from a realistic point of view. But the emotional punch for me worked the way I assume Show wanted it to.

::hands out graduate degree in handwavium mechanics::

I'm not trying to excuse the storyline. I'm just saying that's a plausible reason as to why she's the only person involved who has no memory of the events.

...I think I'm just gonna go over here now.

Also, ::sits with Amy::

Sam was the subject of a wish. Granted, less of a lasting one, but it was undone. Though he appeared to perhaps recall. Magic 8 ball says reply hazy, ask again later.

I did get the impression that we were supposed to be skeeved. But that they either failed to carry things to the logical conclusion. And it would have been satisfying to have her punch the crap out of him.

I did get the impression that we were supposed to be skeeved.

I was skeeved. I still felt sorry for him, too, though, in the end. I guess I just don't feel like I need to look at her trauma under a microscope to get that it was dead wrong.

But that they either failed to carry things to the logical conclusion. And it would have been satisfying to have her punch the crap out of him.

Yup. Everything could have been (mostly) solved to my satisfaction by her reacting in horror and telling him to stay away from her/asking him how he could have done that/punching the hell out of him.

Actually, no. I wanted her to react in horror, ask him how he could have done that, and then tell him to stay away from her. Because then Wes has the double whammy of knowing that he hurt her and never being able to see her again. Bring the pain, mofos.

But the emotional punch for me worked the way I assume Show wanted it to.

I'm not trying to excuse the storyline. I'm just saying that's a plausible reason as to why she's the only person involved who has no memory of the events.

I understand the need to figure out the possible logic behind a mystical act, because, heaven knows, I'm extremely literal. In fact, I like your explanation. But, emotionally, I'm where Amy's at. The show is about metaphor. I try to keep that in mind when I watch the show and not look for anything other than what I see in the show. I used to look at Buffy like it had all the answers to the universe in it and after season 6, I just gave up. I don't do that with TV shows anymore, at least, not purposely. I'm sure I slip, but I really don't want to.

I would be a lot more measured in my response if this show didn't have a history of handling female characters really really badly. And like Plei and Juliana say, it wouldn't have taken much for them to actually acknowledge the wrong here.

As it is, one could easily walk away from this episode and not realize that Hope was raped for a month by the sympathetic geek. Thinking that what Wes did was kinda dodgy, but not actually bad.

I'm not gonna cut them slack just because the show usually deals in metaphor.

So rather than starting from zero with a new season we're watchdogging this particular show, more than new and returning shows which disrespect women with impunity right and left...because? Season three really fell down on race and gender issues?

Seems to me that their standard this season has been, compared to last, fairly high, with the exception of Yellow Fever--and I'm not discounting that may have been a fumble attempting to display character changes--and the lack of a punch to Wes' face by Hope.

My feeling was that the portion of the episode that didn't deal with Sam, Dean, and their respective issues was presented from Wes' point of view. And he saw her distress, and was guilt-stricken about it*, even before the brothers confronted him. True, she didn't get the payoff, but then nothing in the episode was presented from her POV. I may be insensitive and a bad feminist, but it didn't seem odd or wrong to me that Hope wasn't seen to extract revenge by the end of the episode. I have no doubt she will do. But that Wes was seen to understand and suffer remorse from his action seemed sufficient, from his POV.**

I'm from the school of parenting that feels ensuring a child understands and feels and carries the burden of having done a wrong thing (and makes reparation) teaches more than punishment imposed by an outside source. And that when someone has screwed up badly, you give points for improvement rather than pegging your expectations even higher; that feels like a sure formula for failure. *shrugs* Maybe I'm too kumbayah, I don't know.

ETA:*enough that I think he would have done something on his own to cancel the wish had the brothers not confronted him about it.

**I also get that it's a slippery slope not giving viewers the woman's POV. But this isn't a show focused on empowering women, it's never going to be. I agree wholeheartedly the writers desperately need to be more aware of attitudes and stances simply taken for granted, so that things don't wind up in scripts due to laziness or carelessness. But I can't ask this one show to serve the feminist cause above story and viewership and retaining sponsors.