It's not made magically better just because the girl doesn't remember it.

How do you think the show implied that it was "all better"?

It was treated as a tragedy for the wish guy - he gave up his true love, what a sacrifice. Did not look like any of the characters noticed that what he gave up on was raping the woman he had obsessed about. It was an "unhealthy relationship". It really did not seem to occur to anyone that it was worse than that.

Okay, my irl SPN nut friend S had the same qualms about the ending that you did, i.e., Dean should have been more traumatized, but I thought that there was nothing he said that denies that he didn't remember when he was first brought back and started remembering with those flashes.

Nice pickup on the "things I've seen" remark. I was wondering about things that he did and things that were done to him and whether they would address it. Good thinking that Castiel may have blunted the memories.

Of course, the other aspect of this is that as well as JA may act what he is given - quite often the arc stuff isn't executed well in terms of laying in things gradually.

JA does (did) smoke sometimes, I'm pretty sure.

really? that bums me out. not that i'll ever, ya know, have an opportunity to be that close to him. still...

I'm not sure where I read that. Maybe in fic, who knows. But I'm pretty sure he did, even if he doesn't anymore.

I smoke! DON'T YOU WANT TO KISS ME?! ::sobs::

sorry...no. i can't stand to be in a car with someone who's smoking. it makes my eyes burn and i feel like i can't breathe. my sister's a smoker, but she goes outside to smoke because she knows how i feel about it.

Did not look like any of the characters noticed that what he gave up on was raping the woman he had obsessed about. It was an "unhealthy relationship". It really did not seem to occur to anyone that it was worse than that.

Thank you, Gar. The show made the entire issue about Wes, and avoided dealing with the fact that he'd been raping Hope for a month. It wasn't "Oh dear God I've raped a woman, how awful for her!" -- it was "Oh, this makes me uncomfortable and now she's killing people." Even her desperation at the end was caused by the way Wes' wish had taken away her free will. The story was about Wes and his desires, and barely acknowledged the impact on Hope except in the way he noticed it.

Everyone else in the episode remembered what had happened while the wishes were active--except for Hope. Because if she had remembered it, the show would have had to deal with it. So they cheated, and gave her a mind-wipe.

I like Ted Raimi as much as anyone, but the proper response in this kind of situation is more like what we got in the Trio arc on Buffy, not this.

Everyone else in the episode remembered what had happened while the wishes were active--except for Hope.

Were there any other humans who were the subject of a wish? I think the people who MADE wishes remembered, but no one else was the subject of a wish.

but no one else was the subject of a wish.

::hands out graduate degree in handwavium mechanics::

For me, the main plot *was* about Wes, as an object lesson in how wishing goes wrong. And I thought they accomplished that.

Rape is wrong. Wrong like a really wrong thing. But this isn't Law and Order or CSI, the relative "reality" of those shows aside. Supernatural isn't exploring real-life crime, and presenting it mostly realistically. It's using paranormal storylines as metaphors. It's just as awful for me to watch some random guy swallowing razor blades as it is to think that this woman had no idea what she was doing for a month, including having sex with a man it's clear she didn't even know.

But there's an apples and oranges thing at work for me here -- it's the *idea* I'm watching for, that metaphor of watching what you wish for, or how love can be dangerously obsessive, or anger taking root so deeply it manifests (not to mention the ongoing story of Sam and Dean). If this had been Law and Order, and they showed a woman who had been kidnapped and raped for a month, the point of the plot would be to find the perpetrator and punish him, as well as show the traumatic consequences to the victim.

Here, for me, it was abundantly clear that what Wes had done was awful, for him as well as for Hope. The *idea* that wishing for something might turn out horribly wrong came across loud and clear. Honestly, I didn't need Show to then cover how awful it was for Hope. I'm not sure what purpose it would serve in the context of this 42-minute plot. That's ... another show, in my mind.

But I don't think Show was patently putting a seal of approval on rape, either. Were they conveniently glossing it over by having her not remember? I guess you can look at it that way, if you're looking at it from a realistic point of view. But the emotional punch for me worked the way I assume Show wanted it to.