Yes. Lucky for you, people may be in danger.

Buffy ,'Him'


Cable Drama: Still Waiting for the Cable Guy to Show Up with the Thread Name...

To be determined... (but it's definitely [NAFDA])


DavidS - Aug 31, 2010 3:10:45 pm PDT #6563 of 12003
"Look, son, if it's good enough for Shirley Bassey, it's good enough for you."

I don't think the show condones Roger's racism, but just shows it as a fact. And in that time and place and with his position he's not going to suffer any consequences for it except that he's going to be increasingly out of step with the world.

The show does a pretty good job of indicating that Roger's hard feelings are racist when they note that nobody's got an issue about working for a Volkswagen campaign.

Also, the others in the office aren't any more enlightened. They object to Roger's behavior because it's unprofessional, not because it's racist. Bert's interest in Japanese culture is neatly balanced by his total lack of progressive thought with the civil rights movement.

I don't think they're exploiting stereotypes or endorsing anybody's behavior. Like the sexism and the antisemitism and the homophobia it is the characters' unexamined prejudices which reveal so much about the era.


sj - Aug 31, 2010 3:18:35 pm PDT #6564 of 12003
"There are few hours in life more agreeable than the hour dedicated to the ceremony known as afternoon tea."

Leverage: How did the con get the girl out of custody?


Jesse - Aug 31, 2010 3:44:46 pm PDT #6565 of 12003
Sometimes I trip on how happy we could be.

The problem with Roger is not that you're supposed to understand his viewpoint(s), but that you're supposed to like him anyway. Which I often do, thanks to John Slattery -- he says the most offensive shit, and it makes me laugh. Oh, Roger! But that doesn't mean I think it's right, or OK, and I don't think Matthew Weiner does, either.

Although, the whole show is slightly tainted for me after hearing that he doesn't think Betty is a bad mother. So lord knows what he really thinks about the rest of it...


§ ita § - Aug 31, 2010 4:03:44 pm PDT #6566 of 12003
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.

Neal dressing Peter. A little something inside me just up and died in absolute pleasure.


Lee - Aug 31, 2010 4:43:54 pm PDT #6567 of 12003
The feeling you get when your brain finally lets your heart get in its pants.

Oh god, yes.


Jesse - Aug 31, 2010 4:47:16 pm PDT #6568 of 12003
Sometimes I trip on how happy we could be.

I just have to say how ridiculous it is to think of one person going in to do an audit.


Jessica - Aug 31, 2010 4:59:40 pm PDT #6569 of 12003
And then Ortus came and said "It's Ortin' time" and they all Orted off into the sunset

The problem with Roger is not that you're supposed to understand his viewpoint(s), but that you're supposed to like him anyway.

As a person or as a TV character, though? Because for me, he's firmly in that category of "I love you and THANK FUCKING GOD YOU'RE NOT REAL."


Scrappy - Aug 31, 2010 5:10:49 pm PDT #6570 of 12003
Life moves pretty fast. You don't stop and look around once in a while, you could miss it.

Yeah, I like that Roger is both genuinely charming AND genuinely racist. This is the man who did a blackface routine at a party after all. It's an interesting character choice.

As to his attitude, it seems true to the time. My mother will not visit Germany when she is with my Bro in Europe. She--the lifelong liberal--firmly says she will never forgive them. Not only did friends of hers die at their hands, the Holocaust is inexcusable. Intellectually, she knows it's a lot of new people, but she can't get past her anger.


§ ita § - Aug 31, 2010 5:20:21 pm PDT #6571 of 12003
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.

Start with Neal dressing Peter, continue with Neal rushing to save a delirious Peter's life (and Peter being all noble), and then the whole "I'm glad I know the .... people .... I know" speech and the pledge not to lie to each other?

People, be gentle with me.


Nora Deirdre - Aug 31, 2010 5:48:42 pm PDT #6572 of 12003
I’m responsible for my own happiness? I can’t even be responsible for my own breakfast! (Bojack Horseman)

And how much reveal did we actually get about Sophie's backstory?

Yeah, I'm confused. Was that her aunt? Was it a fellow con artist? Why did she sell out Charlotte about their family to the bad guy afterward?

Any thoughts from the hivemind on this?