Spike totally survived Not Fade Away. I'm not sure why I'm so convinced of that, though.

I could totally buy that, but I'd rather not know officially from the only official source. That's definitely one of those things that plays better in the imagination.

Spike totally survived Not Fade Away. I'm not sure why I'm so convinced of that, though.

Even if I agreed (and he was in much worse shape then Angel), either they have to address the question, which gives me answers I don't necessarily want to know, even if they are coming from Joss, or they avoid the issue somehow, which I can't imagine as being anything other than a lame copout.

I think it's interesting how avidly people don't want to know. I don't think that continuing the story in comic book form is anywhere near as satisfying as doing it on the small screen. But I don't have a problem with knowing how it all turned out.

They're all alive right now, in a Heisenbergy Schrödingerish sort of a way. But Joss can open the box, no problem for me.

In my brain:

Illyria not only survived, but fucked up the W&H army right good, and promptly disappeared to brood and mourn Wesley in cryptic but eloquent paragraphs under a gloomy sky somewhere.

Angel probably died, but the alleyway was such a mess of dismembered limbs and ichor and the dust of many, many vampires that nobody will ever know for certain. His possible dust is tucked away neatly in Schrödinger's box, and my brain reserves the right to un-dust or never-dusted-in-the-first-place-ify him if a plausible and entertaining scenario presents itself.

Spike died, but the prophecy that Angel signed away fell on him; just because Angel had the power to give it up (although maybe he didn't; I haven't opened the box yet and looked inside) doesn't mean he had the power to un-prophesy it. It had to happen to someone, and since Spike was the only souled vampire around who'd played a key role in an apocalypse or two, it conveniently happened to him. So the morning after the battle, he was bewildered and mildly horrified to find himself not killed in battle but instead alive, mortal, bruised all to shit, desperately hungry, and somehow transported back to the London alleyway where Dru bit him over a hundred years ago. The neighborhood has changed considerably, all his joints are screaming in pain, the scar on his eyebrow has reopened and won't stop trickling and itching, and he has no money and no cigarettes. He hasn't figured out exactly what's happened yet, but he's already royally hacked off about it.

Gunn is dead. I don't want him to be, and my brain worked like a mad thing on any number of last-minute-escape scenarios, but in the end even the best of them was just too wanky. I'm very cross with my brain about this.

My brain doesn't necessarily need to see any of this played out, though. It will, however, happily devour all six issues of S8 Buffy.

Gunn is dead. I don't want him to be, and my brain worked like a mad thing on any number of last-minute-escape scenarios, but in the end even the best of them was just too wanky. I'm very cross with my brain about this.

Yeah, that assumtption is hard to avoid, because Illyria pretty much told him he was dead man walking when he showed up.

I always suspected that Angel was still powered up on whatever he got out of Adam Baldwin, and stood a good chance of surviving.

I always figured Illyria survived - any being that can take apart a car without breaking a sweat isn't going to be fazed by a few hundred monsterous demonoid types.

I really like your Spike scenario on the why of survival, but not so sure I care for having him back in the era where he got turned.

Yeah, that assumtption is hard to avoid, because Illyria pretty much told him he was dead man walking when he showed up.

Well, Amy Acker said at a con a couple weeks ago that if there had been another season, Gunn would have been a vampire, and he would end up staking himself.

Oh, no, he's not back in that era. He's just back in that alleyway, right now. Or right last year. Anyhow, not back then, just back there.

Oh, no, he's not back in that era. He's just back in that alleyway, right now. Or right last year. Anyhow, not back then, just back there.

Ah, OK. That's OK then. That's actually a scenario I could live with.

Yeah, I almost thought the same as Frank, but got it from the "neighborhood's changed" comment.