You're talking to Serenity. And, Early... Serenity is very unhappy.

River ,'Objects In Space'


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Discussion of Buffy and Angel comics, books, and more. Please don't get into spoilery details in the first week of release.


amych - Jul 20, 2004 7:21:41 am PDT #4915 of 10000
Now let us crush something soft and watch it fountain blood. That is a girlish thing to want to do, yes?

Plei, sadly no -- any idea if they're around virtually anywhere?


P.M. Marc - Jul 20, 2004 7:28:05 am PDT #4916 of 10000
So come, my friends, be not afraid/We are so lightly here/It is in love that we are made; In love we disappear

Plei, sadly no -- any idea if they're around virtually anywhere?

They might be in a few days... I'll let you know if/when they are.

Chilling moment the second, Ollie and Batman: "I may not like it, but Hal was just trying to help." "Maybe." "What would you have done if you were in Wally's boots?" "The same thing I'm doing now. I'd worry."

In retrospect, there seems to be a lot of set up in here. which, as it's the title that's said to be most affected by the fallout, makes sense.


sumi - Jul 20, 2004 7:32:32 am PDT #4917 of 10000
Art Crawl!!!

Was the second also from the Flash?


sumi - Jul 20, 2004 7:32:43 am PDT #4918 of 10000
Art Crawl!!!

Oops.


P.M. Marc - Jul 20, 2004 7:42:19 am PDT #4919 of 10000
So come, my friends, be not afraid/We are so lightly here/It is in love that we are made; In love we disappear

Was the second also from the Flash?

Flash 209.


Matt the Bruins fan - Jul 20, 2004 8:02:50 am PDT #4920 of 10000
"I remember when they eventually introduced that drug kingpin who murdered people and smuggled drugs inside snakes and I was like 'Finally. A normal person.'” —RahvinDragand

I think the past event turning out to be Dr. Light raping Sue as a way to attack the menfolk (he wasn't even an Elongated Man villain, was he?) and then chortling and leering about it like a Will Eisner villain from WWII was just too over-the-top for me. I would have much preferred it if something Sue had done personally and proactively—like perhaps figuring out a scheme of Dr. Light's and netting him a prison sentence—had initiated a reason for him to attack her specifically.

That would help offset the "Aha! I have stumbled across [insert hero's name here]'s (a) sidekick (b) love interest (c) pet (d) all of the above and can use it to get at him!" vibe I got from this issue .


§ ita § - Jul 20, 2004 8:07:30 am PDT #4921 of 10000
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.

I don't know much about Sue Dibny, so I don't know if they short-changed her and removed her agency (which is what bugged me about Fred -- she used to be useful, but they made a scenario in which she had to be damsel) or not. I have been taking for granted that the story basically required a virgin to sacrifice on an altar to engender what's come up so far. I find some of the characters reacting patronisingly, but I don't get that from the author yet.

I don't mind a story in which abuse against women is the worst thing that can happen on a micro-scale -- I mind it when I feel the author's telling me that's true outside the story as well.


DavidS - Jul 20, 2004 8:32:03 am PDT #4922 of 10000
"Look, son, if it's good enough for Shirley Bassey, it's good enough for you."

Ple, after you talked specifically about Silver Age characters and sexism, I couldn't help but notice that that the men characters involved in the mindwipe are the ones most strongly associated with the Silver Age. Flash and Green Lantern foremost, with Atom and Hawkman right behind. Green Arrow being the exception, since he's really a second tier Golden Age character that got a second life post-Silver Age with the late sixties Arrow/Lantern team-ups. It couldn't be mere happenstance that the big three Golden Age heroes were excluded.


sumi - Jul 20, 2004 8:43:28 am PDT #4923 of 10000
Art Crawl!!!

Plei -- would the Flash arc you're talking about start after the issues collected in this tpb?


P.M. Marc - Jul 20, 2004 9:21:05 am PDT #4924 of 10000
So come, my friends, be not afraid/We are so lightly here/It is in love that we are made; In love we disappear

Yep. It's the arc that starts in the aftermath of Blitz.

Sometimes, I really like Wally. Which is remarkable, because I very often just want to smack him over the head with a cluestick.