Anya: Are you stupid or something? Giles: Allow me to answer that question with a firing.

'Sleeper'


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Discussion of Buffy and Angel comics, books, and more. Please don't get into spoilery details in the first week of release.


amych - Jul 15, 2004 7:40:49 am PDT #4870 of 10000
Now let us crush something soft and watch it fountain blood. That is a girlish thing to want to do, yes?

I thought the only

Yep, ita.


P.M. Marc - Jul 15, 2004 7:43:22 am PDT #4871 of 10000
So come, my friends, be not afraid/We are so lightly here/It is in love that we are made; In love we disappear

Matt: the line you're thinking of is "Clark and Diana would never understand." Which I tend to agree with, because while I think Diana at least would understand if they'd just killed him, the particulars of what they did are pretty not-okay. As for "Oliver's overprotective chauvinism toward Dinah (which was immediately challenged, but still contributes to the overall mood)," I think I would have been bothered if Ollie hadn't acted as he did, because it would have seemed out of character for the post-Quiver Queen. Regarding "I'm really impressed with the the way the plot is being structured and laid out, but there's little in the world that's as sure to piss me off as the whole "the womenfolk are under attack, so the menfolk have to go get vengeancey" trope," I'm probably cheerfully reading too much into this, but I'm seeing IC as going to a place where it's exploring the ugly assumptions that dominated a lot of Silver Age stuff, even when it was trying to be progressive.


amych - Jul 15, 2004 7:45:02 am PDT #4872 of 10000
Now let us crush something soft and watch it fountain blood. That is a girlish thing to want to do, yes?

re: your last, Plei, I very much hope so.


victor infante - Jul 15, 2004 7:45:35 am PDT #4873 of 10000
To understand what happened at the diner, we shall use Mr. Papaya! This is upsetting because he's the friendliest of fruits.

Ita's correct. Even Ralph was surprised, and it seems as if he may not have approved if he HAD known. I think the "woman in the refrigerator " complaints are extremely valid, but I'm enjoying the story immensely anyway.


P.M. Marc - Jul 15, 2004 7:46:13 am PDT #4874 of 10000
So come, my friends, be not afraid/We are so lightly here/It is in love that we are made; In love we disappear

Also, Matt, IIRC they don't consult Ralph, either. Ralph and Sue are both gone when they make their decision. I totally want to see the fallout of all this in the Flash title, given Wally's recent actions and decisions WRT his own identity.


Matt the Bruins fan - Jul 15, 2004 7:46:20 am PDT #4875 of 10000
"I remember when they eventually introduced that drug kingpin who murdered people and smuggled drugs inside snakes and I was like 'Finally. A normal person.'” —RahvinDragand

I thought the only people that knew were the ones that were right there, right then.

Yes. The thing setting off my chauvinism-dar in that respect is Diana being specifically mentioned as one of the one's who can't be allowed to find out. Admittedly, without IC#1 in hand I may be remembering this wrong, or it might be an indication of the narrator's chauvinism rather than the writer's. But my emotional response to the story is pretty much the same as amych's, and I get the feeling that Black canary is being presented as the exception that proves the rule rather than actually de-fusing the sense of sexism .


§ ita § - Jul 15, 2004 7:46:46 am PDT #4876 of 10000
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.

I agree with Plei when she says:

the particulars of what they did are pretty not-okay.

If I were one of the participants, I wouldn't assume anyone would understand who wasn't right there, and even then ... there's the "take no life, mess with no mind" crowd and there's the "well, kill the fuck" crowd. The dicey place is the one where they all stand.


amych - Jul 15, 2004 7:47:13 am PDT #4877 of 10000
Now let us crush something soft and watch it fountain blood. That is a girlish thing to want to do, yes?

d'oh! I knew there was a reason I was going to start picking up the Flash.


P.M. Marc - Jul 15, 2004 7:48:35 am PDT #4878 of 10000
So come, my friends, be not afraid/We are so lightly here/It is in love that we are made; In love we disappear

re: your last, Plei, I very much hope so.

It makes sense, at least in my head.


P.M. Marc - Jul 15, 2004 7:50:44 am PDT #4879 of 10000
So come, my friends, be not afraid/We are so lightly here/It is in love that we are made; In love we disappear

Matt: Diana is specifically mentioned, but she's specifically mentioned with Clark, and I don't think that's unimportant.